Author: Grey Prophet
Description: A heated confrontation with Celestia over her portrayal as Nightmare Moon and her sister's authoritarianism leads Luna to search for answers about the past, unwittingly tangling Twilight and her friends into a cosmic struggle between order and chaos that ultimately inspires only more questions. Set one year after the first two episodes.Frigid Winds and Burning Hearts (All Links) (New Chapter 14!)
Additional Tags: political, confrontation, tough love,history
196 comments:
This sounds really good!
ReplyDeleteCelestia, you bitch! I knew you were at tyrant, but rewriting history so your own sister is vilified and remembered only as a madmare bent on destroying the world? F**K YOU!
ReplyDelete@ToonNinja
ReplyDeleteremember, this is just a fanfiction.
@Anonymous
ReplyDelete...Yeah. Totally knew that. Just a fanfic. Nothing more.
*Puts sweater on over "Down with Celestia" t-shirt*
Hmm. Intriguing. I certainly wouldn't mind reading more.
ReplyDeleteI'm intrigued with where this is going. It certainly has a lot of potential.
ReplyDeleteOne of the amazing things about Luna is how many different ways people develop her character. There's so little of her actually on screen, what we get is sort of like a Rorschach ink blot to which we can assign our own meaning.
ReplyDeleteIn a way, it's going to be kind of sad when we get to see more of the "real" Luna in season 2, as it will reduce possibilities for this kind of fan redefining.
This isn't my favorite of the Luna stories (that would be a tie between "Moonbeam" and "Progress"), but it definitely takes her in an interesting direction. I'd like to see more of it.
(I wish people would use fanfic.net instead of Google Docs, though. fanfic.net gives me a lot less computer trouble reading.)
Brilliant. I really hated how most fanfics treat Luna like a little child begging her for forgiveness. This is the Luna I've been wanting to see. I anxiously wait for more
ReplyDeleteThis is clearly another five-star story.
ReplyDeleteI like this interpretation of Luna the best, I think. I'm really excited to see where you go with this story!
ReplyDeleteI very much like this take on Luna. The idea of her as a free spirit and an artist is, to my knowledge, one that has never been explored, and I love the
ReplyDeleteway it clashes with Celestia's calculating, politically-motivated nature. It makes her vulnerable without making her weak, which is something I see too often in depictions of Luna.
The descriptive imagery is beautiful, the characterizations are fresh, and the punctuation of action- the spatter of violence- is appropriately shocking. If anything, I would encourage you to be a bit less repetitive; you dwell perhaps overlong on Luna's emotions. And if that is your intention, make them stronger, make them angrier- make us realize that you spend so much time on them because they are just that violent.
In short, more emotion! More pathos! You've filled your story with it, and there's no going back, so press on and fear not! Five stars.
Nightmare Moon looks like Arbiter in that picture
ReplyDeleteThis is breath taking! The writing is so intelligent and the revelation... wow!
ReplyDelete@Chris Meadows
ReplyDeleteYou should read Luna's Good Will Tour if you liked those other 2, I regard it as the best of all!
This is a flawed work of genius; I feel like I'm witnessing the development of someone who could become a really talented writer. The characterizations are both interesting and true to the show, and the technical aspects of the writing are by turns brilliant and poorly executed. I think this line best encapsulates the whole thing:
ReplyDelete"Celestia’s single, massive star subjugating the skies to conform to a uniform blue and Luna’s multitude of stars shining and swirling across the chaotic void were fitting metaphors for their respective personalities. "
The metaphor is superb, the execution of it less so. The sentence just kind of peters out at the end, leaving the whole thing feeling a bit stilted. Explicitly spelling out that you're using a metaphor is rarely good form. Something along the lines of, "Their portfolios match their personalities: Celestia’s single, massive star subjugates the skies to conform to a uniform blue while Luna’s multitude of stars shine and swirl across the chaotic void" avoids explicitly mentioning metaphor and cuts out superfluous words. The overly formal tone of the above sentence is a persistent flaw in the technical aspects of the writing, though the only one.
The framing device at the start, before the flashback, doesn't feel like it does enough to justify its inclusion. It's a decent excuse to dump some characterization and backstory before diving into the meat of the tale, but at the moment it seems a smidge too transparent. I would flit back and forth between the exposition and signs of Luna's distress to keep us more immediately in the moment and to build more suspense of figuring out what's caused her to be so distressed.
Constructive criticism aside, I loved this story. Celestia and Luna's characters, though at times told instead of shown, are really interesting, and I especially love the hints at a deeper mythology that are never fully explained.
Awesome. I really tired of all those 'pls forgive me' fics, glad to see something different. And yes, somehow everyone else managed to live without Celestia.
ReplyDeleteBy Celestia's beard, that was some really good stuff. I enjoyed it from start to finish, and I can't wait for more.
ReplyDeleteInteresting dilemma Celestia is presented by Luna
ReplyDeleteI like Lina a lot, she is easily my third favorite, but I think it would be the other way around. I see her as more of the one incline to keep the old ways of nobels and Monarchs. Then again I think the same applies to Celestia, to be frank I just can't picture either of them wanting to give up their power. And I doubt they would care if anyone didn't let them do what they pleases. But those are just my thoughts.
ReplyDeleteI wish for mooooooooore!
ReplyDeleteThis was great! I always figure there was more to that whole Nightmare Moon thing, then Celestia let on. Figures Luna would be wise and generous enough to let ponies rule themselves. So that said I now declare my Luna for President Shirt Stand open!
ReplyDeleteHey ponies need democracy and shirts.
Hoo boy. Bitch be gonna wreck some fools....
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete@Anonymous
ReplyDeleteHa, thanks for catching those weaknesses, you're dead-on right. I like your suggestions, particularly regarding the structure of the story. As for that metaphor, I struggled with the execution for quite a bit, but you're right, I should give it the attention it deserves.
Now I'm just contemplating whether to do a rewrite or move on..
@Grey Prophet
ReplyDeleteRather than worry about whether what you posted already is good enough... Move on to the continuation. This story is the best take on Luna that I've seen yet. It's heart wrenching, and I want to see more.
If you keep going back to what you started with and try to rewrite it, you will never finish.
“No! Stop thinking about the past! Think of something else!"
Think about the future of this story, and move forward. I'm gonna go crawl into bed now and have sad dreams about poor Luna till you finish the story. OK.
This is something different with Luna and I love it. Going to re-read and play " For The New Lunar Republic" by Not A Clever Pony... Great job need more!!
ReplyDeleteBest take of Celestia/Luna I've seen yet. Amazing.
ReplyDeleteOne of the best and most plausible explorations of the Tyrant Celestia idea I've seen. You have good ideas; with more experience, I'm sure your writing will catch up!
ReplyDeleteVery good story so far; I was playing with the idea of writing something about Twilight studying old ponytales and picking out inconsistencies in Celestia's portrayal, and suggesting that originally some were about Luna, but she was written out following her banishment, but this takes that idea to much better places. I'm looking forward to more, and seeing how the mane 6 react... which of them will dismiss Luna as insane, and which will have more Lunatic tendancies ("You mean to tell me that my beloved sister has spent the last thousand years turning my name into a symonym for MADMARE?!").
ReplyDeleteAlso, is there something I need to do to get the star rating up on blogposts? Sometimes its there, sometimes it isn't, and right now it isn't and I want to give this five stars, damnit...
This was a well written and interesting fic, I love the premise of it. I definitely hope the author continues!
ReplyDelete@Sigil
ReplyDeleteIf she runs it'll have to be as the *ahem* Dark Horse candidate. ;-)
I really enjoyed this story once it got going, but... that opening is just awful. I'm sorry. I almost closed the document before finishing page one. I skipped ahead a bit, saw that you eventually quit with the purple prose, then went back to start over.
ReplyDeleteIt's awkward and stilted; you're throwing in long words for no reason other than to show off that you know long words. Once you cut that out and start writing normally, the quality improves enormously.
Frankly I don't see any reason for the framing anyway. All it does is delay starting in on the story. If there is any information in the prologue that you need to impart, work it into the flow of the story rather than wrapping it in vocabulary and shoving it out in front.
My question is, why does "shouting" merit a tag?
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteSo the elements gave the Mane 6 immortatlity interesting concept. Though a question arises why would Celestia continue to paint her sister a villain? Also what will happen to the mane cast. Once Luna's immortality is restored
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteWow, my good sir. You have done an excellent job.
ReplyDeleteI was literally shaking with rage after the first part.
And to add to that, Hymn To Red October started playing.
I dare say, if I could have gone to Equestria that moment, I am sure I would have struck Celestia down myself.
Good job, my good sir, good job indeed.
Let me try this again:
ReplyDeleteTwilight is Celestia's student, and basically a known entity around the royal court who has free reign around the princess. So I find it odd that, circumstances or not, the first thing the Royal Guard decided to do to go to Twilight's house, rough her up and break shit. Especially when one of the guardsmen seemed to actually know her. Though if I misread something please let me know.
Otherwise, this chapter was a pretty good continuation of the events of the last one. I'm still quite interested in where this story is going, and I still like the idea in terms of a literary device that Celestia consolidated her power by demonizing her sister for a thousand years.
I was also not expecting the revelation towards the end of the story to happen, and that is quite a hook for the next chapter. It is also well-written into the story and helps explains certain things in the chapter, so it isn't an out of nowhere twist.
MANURE JUST GOT REAL.
ReplyDelete@TenchiFreak5
ReplyDeleteAt least in my conceptualization, the Royal Guard is a corp of soldiers who are unquestionably obedient. A reflection of Celestia's authoritarian tendencies, it is pragmatic and decisive. It will complete its objectives as quickly and efficiently as possible even if that entails excessive force. Since General Hawkeye is at the helm, I feel that a military pony would have few qualms roughing up a scholar if that means accomplishing his mission.
Very good story! Really loved how much you fleshed out Luna and Celestia in this episode.
ReplyDeleteWOW! Celestia is a tyrant for real! I hope this doesn´t evolve into something sad...
ReplyDeleteAlso; MOOOOOOARR
ReplyDelete@Anonymous
ReplyDeleteLol didn't mean episode
I keep thinking of this video.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yFB67WmuIc
Celestia is the final boss.
I'm looking forward to the next chapter!
Arright, finished second chapter.
ReplyDeleteWhen is the next one out?
Forgive my impatience, but this is simply amazing.
My only complaint is that ye have set Celestia back down into my hate.
But, that is to be expected from such a story.
If the first bit wasn't enough, the fact she did it a second time did.
Amazingly done, my good sir.
You have once again played on my emotions to where I cannot help but to stand by my first comment.
Anywho, I'm ranting now.
Good day to ye, Luna bless.
I just finished the second chapter and well I am impressed beyond my normal expectations. Great story and so well written, I feel bad for Luna, how history and her own sister have conspire against her. Celestia is truly an evil tyrant and a horrible sister, I mean sending out the Royal Guard and declaring Luna has gone rouge again. Celestia has has lost a lot of points in my book.
ReplyDeleteMaybe it's just me, but aren't the Guards going around and roughing things up because Celestia is "missing"?
ReplyDeleteHoly. Fucking. Cupcakes. This story is a shining example of the potential that all fanfiction has. The only word I can use to describe it is beautiful. Thank you!
ReplyDeleteI hope Celestia 'missing' because she realized her mistakes and gone to do some serious soul-reseaching.
ReplyDeleteThis has been a very good read so far.
ReplyDeletePlease do keep up the work and effort you are pouring into this fic. It is most enjoyable.
Holy heck, this is now compulsory reading for everypony ever. If I could give 6 stars I would.
ReplyDeleteWhy, Celestia, why?
ReplyDeleteIf this keeps up, fanfics like this are going to make me start to hate canon!Celestia :(
This is brilliant. I must say, these fanfics make me wish these stories were canon. I hate it when I need to wait for the next part, but I can certainly wait for this.
ReplyDeleteRemoved Dx
ReplyDeleteSorry all, but someone flagged the document as "inappropriate". I'll post a new link for Chapter 2 when I submit Chapter 3. It's also on FF.net if you really want to find it.
ReplyDeleteRemoved :( too bad, part 1 is lovely!
ReplyDeleteThis is well-written for the most part. Very out-of-character for the established chars. But, this is fanfic, so knock yourself out.
ReplyDeletelunaxbig mac just makes sense
ReplyDeletei approve of this future shipping
Great just like the past 2 chapters.
ReplyDeleteI'd rather the story just stay with Luna's perspective. The pacing will feel off if you have a chapter on Apple Jack talking to Pinkie and Rarity after the craziness of what is happening and I honestly can't see it effecting the story much so I say pass on that. You can still get across how they felt with their dialogue to Luna
Chapter 2 was nuked by Failgle. Need a new link.
ReplyDeleteOnce again, amazingly done.
ReplyDeleteKeep at it.
I think ye should keep it from L:una's perspective as much as ye can, though that's just me.
I've never wrote one so I have no experience.
Anywho, you are officially my favorite author.
Congratulations.
"and, for some reason, a fish wrapped in some newspaper was flailing on the ground."
ReplyDeleteI LOL'd.
I think we might need to slap a Grimdark tag on here. No one was killed, but it did get pretty bloody, and it has the rather disturbing theme of police brutality.
ReplyDeletein the meantime, heres a link to the fanfic on FF.Net (as mentioned by the author them self) for any impatient bronies :)
ReplyDeletehttp://www.fanfiction.net/s/7037421/1/Frigid_Winds_and_Burning_Hearts
I tried giving this fic a chance, I really did. And while it's written competantly, I couldn't enjoy it for one simple reason.
ReplyDeleteI hate hate hate hate HATE stories and theories that paint Celestia as a power-mad dictator. It doesn't mix with what I've seen of her in the series. But, I can state that from an objective standpoint, there's nothing really WRONG with this story. I just don't agree with it. But those that do enjoy it, hey, at least it's one of the better stories.
The guardponies' scene in Ponyville was agonizingly badly done, and unfortunately detracted from an otherwise enjoyable story.
ReplyDelete@Kyle: Celestia appears to have gone missing, so it seems like she's not a tyrant here, and there might be an explanation for why history is written the way it is. Read on.
ReplyDeleteI agree that the guardsponies were too evil: if Celestia is as good at manipulation as she seems, and if she does believe it is in the interests of everyone that she remains in power, why would she need... no, why would she tolerate such sadistic behavior in her guard? It could only alienate ponies from her government, when she seems to have put a lot of effort into the "benevolent" aspect of "benevolent dictator". Hopefully it was just the one squad, and any future guardsponies won't be quite so keen on violence...
ReplyDeleteI enjoyed part 1, but now that I'm on part 3 I just can't get through it. It's paced way too slowly for a "Luna is on the run from the guard" story.
ReplyDeleteI think this chapter has been derailed rather thoroughly by the Royal Guards (which is a shame, because I really liked how you used Big Ma).
ReplyDeleteFor Chapter 2, the explanation that the Guards were simply trying to get results in the most efficient way possible was perfectly valid, because their actions were rather forceful considering the target but they were still clearly looking for information.
For this chapter, it really didn't work, because this time it seemed less about getting shit done and more about hurting everypony and causing mayhem and havoc.
Now, if this was a straight "Celestia is a tyrant" story, it would be fine; but in this story she's supposedly trying to atone for past tyrannical actions she performed hundreds of years or so in the past, and yet she apparently still has a personal secret police right out of 1984? Why?
I also say that the use of the term "batshit insane" by Luna in her inner monologue about halfway through stuck out to me as a particularly weird term for her to know/use.
Hmm, a fair assessment. What I wanted to accomplish through the violence were:
ReplyDelete1) How the army behaves when the government(in this case, Celestia) effectively disappears. Rarely will you ever see a military in this situation not resort to some brutal tactics, no matter how peaceful or morally good they were in peace time.
2) The desperation of the guard to maintain order. The way they see it, Celestia's return is the only solution. If anyone interferes with their goal (e.g. Big Mac), well I don't need to spell it out.
3) Getting rid of Captain Braveheart, so I can later describe the army's role through other, less crude characters.
4) I wanted to show Luna in a strong light. I also wanted her to ask the same sort of questions you all are asking: "How did a pony like Captain Braveheart gain his rank?"
Sorry if the realism of the story contrasts too sharply with the show, but I wanted this to be a political and historical exploration. It is unfortunate that these topics can seldom be as happy as the show.
For those who think I'm Celestia bashing, trust me when I say she'll get her word in. Celestia is my favorite character, so I assure you she's not just torturing poor little Luna.
Perhaps I'm too keen on defending the little spat of violence. Obviously I failed in making it clear in the story, but such an explicit explanation seems very unlikely to be given, at least yet. At any rate, I just ask for patience as the story develops.
On a lighter note, I do not like shipping. The kiss was purely an example of Luna's libertine emotional expression.
part 2 is down because of a terms of service violations...
ReplyDelete@Grey Prophet
ReplyDeleteAs much sense as that makes, they threatened to actually burn Sweet Apple Acres to the ground over some pretty trivial stuff. This is freaking Equestria; I don't think they'd start resorting to tactics straight out of the Crusades not even 24 hours after Celestia's disappearance.
@ToonNinja
ReplyDelete"They" did not threaten. The captain did, and he's somewhat of a hot-headed windbag. Would he actually carry out half his threats? Patience, patience is all I can ask.
Also, an apocalyptic environment would probably make people feel it ware back in the crusades.
good story so far, i look foreword to reading more of your work :). though if Luna did die (and i really hope she doesn't) i wonder if it would resemble the Doctor Who episode "The Pandorica Opens" were there are no stars, no moon, only the "Sun" (read:slowly exploding tardis) sailing though a sea of utter darkness.
ReplyDeletein terms of the over all story it's very hard to inject realism into this type of source material without having the characters of the story be "out of character" MLP:FIM is a welcome fantasy land on an all to jaded internet and thats one reason i love it. but if you try to take a closer look at the mechanics of the world as a whole you end up with a lot of logic gaps. and in many ways thats good. when i watch FiM i don't really want to watch an episode on the class struggle of earth ponies with the unicorn and pegesie or about ponyvills flagging economy, thats why i read fanfic's.
but when fleshing out the world for this type of thriller those gaps need to be filled and i have no problem that. the best thing any story can do is suck you in and make you think. "Why are the guards acting this way?" "what happened to Celestia?" "what will happen to sweet apple archers?" "what will happen to Luna?" "On one hand Luna has a point, but looking at our own history Celestia's points are valid as well." all thees and more i look foreword to discovering as i read (hopefully) more of this interesting story.
side note/nitpick: small error i noticed, <"Oh mah sun! Yer Princess Luna!" Applejack cried out> pretty sure thats supposed to be apple bloom. but seeing as they both start with apple thats a very understandable typo
MOAR! I love political drama <3333
ReplyDeleteRight now, I'm just wondering how the heck ''Captain Braveheart'' became Captain in the first place... being some sort of weird psychopathic masochist ??
ReplyDeleteYOu know... being Equestria and all ? ,and not the Griffin Kingdom ?
Applebloom's part with her sweet (child-like) innocence was pretty good. I can imagine Luna being touched by her words :).
Need MOAR ponies like Applebloom, and less ''Captain Braveheart''.
Odds bodkins, this is a helluva fic. Definitely getting added to my list of "check the page every five minutes for the next update" fics. =O
ReplyDelete@Nova25
ReplyDeleteI can say as an ex Sargent in the US army, a lot of high ranking military men are quite psychopathic. Put it this way, the more ruthless you are, the more chances you take in order to get those high ranking positions. Not in all cases but its alot.
Works in all professions as well, not just the army. Politics is a good example.
O dawg part 2 is screwed up alt link if you dont mind.
ReplyDelete...
ReplyDeleteWTF is up with the Equestrian military???
@Anon ^ The equestrian Military needs more fish wrapped in newspapers in their ranks.
ReplyDeleteI love this, and while I was hooked from the start, your fish wrapped in newspaper worked very well to rip the reader out of the super serious state of the fight and flight. I thought the joke was good during Applebloom's examination of the the kitchen disaster, but it was even better at the end of the fight.
Congratulations on getting a TV Tropes article for this story.
ReplyDeleteI enjoy this story, and I especially love the take on Luna and Celestia, but chapter 3 felt...off to me, still enjoyable, but not as good as the first 2 chapters imo.
ReplyDeleteOh my lord Celsetia/Sauron connection.
ReplyDeleteDamn, Celestia's really got the whole "brainwashing the masses" thing down. Poor Twilight's world just got shaken to its core.
ReplyDeleteFucking a...
ReplyDeleteI need to avoid this story until it's done. Every time I get to the end of a chapter update I want to scream "MORE!" until I explode.
This doesn't mean I will, though. -_-
Captain Braveheart, man. Fuck that guy.
ReplyDeleteAlso, it seems that Twilight has basically just been broken. She could use a good hug. I'm conflicted, because in the verbal smackdown between her an Luna, they both had pretty good points.
Wow, this is great thus far. Who said a story about ponies couldn't have such incredible psychological dilemmas? Can't wait for chapter 5!
ReplyDeleteThis story makes me empathize with people who dislike the whole "Tyrant Celestia" concept. I find it hilarious with things like communist banners and stuff, but when it's described like it is here I can't keep myself from hoping there's some other reason for all the happenings in this story than a power-hungry goddess alicorn pony (at least one that's Celestia or Luna).
ReplyDeleteAw, great. Now I'm speculating. Confound *yadda-yadda-yadda*.
Awesome read, by the way!
@VFX Kid
ReplyDeleteYou ARE familiar with the Pony Psychology series, yes?
@ToonNinja
ReplyDeleteMy god. The idea that someone isn't is somehow more terrifying than Celestia is in this fic. 0_o
Luna and Twilight's Argument was fantastic
ReplyDelete@ToonNinja
ReplyDeleteDid I say I wasn't? Did I say that I didn't think that it was possible? I was just saying how some people who are unfamiliar with the awesomeness that is this show and its fanbase would assume that anything about ponies could only go so deep psychologically. But both the Pony Psychology series and this fic(along with some others, no doubt)would uproot those baseless assumptions in ten seconds flat.
Thanks for the feedback, though I can't help but feel a bit dissatisfied with Chapter 4.
ReplyDelete@Chris Meadowsperosonally, my favorite Luna story is either this one, or Blue Moon
ReplyDeleteplease continue this story, it's so awesome
ReplyDeleteMOAR I DEMAND IT
ReplyDeleteI don't really care for the whole Twilight Sparkle/Lightning Strike thing. It seems very unnecessary. I read about half of that section then just skipped to the end.
ReplyDeleteThis gives me the impression that I'm not the only one who plays Victoria 2 with the Equestria mod...
ReplyDeleteNot sure if I like the take on the whole initial battle with Luna and Celestia in this Initial update. But I'm interested as to what Celestia's Purpose is for all of this
ReplyDeleteI'm still not sure why Luna thought that her plan was a good idea.
ReplyDeleteHeh. Rest assured, I'm still following this. And I doubt I'll stop, I definitely want to see where this is going.
ReplyDeleteHave a good time in Europe.
I'm starting to think Luna is a bit insane
ReplyDeleteHm. Nice to see what actually happened on that faithful night.
ReplyDeleteSo, if I'm reading the Author's Notes correctly, when Luna said "Republic" she meant "ruling class who pay lip service to the bourgeois, but don't really giving a shit because they have no need to." Was that what you were going for? It seemed pretty straightforward, but I want to make sure.
@Anonymous
The vibes I'm getting from the situation is that Luna wanted a modern-day democratic-style representative government, and was trying hard as hell to force the issue. The problem being, she was trying to do it in a society similar to that of Holy Roman Empire-era Europe (where such a thing obviously wouldn't work), and she was manipulated by her adviser into thinking it would work (probably as a power grab by the adviser).
Celestia knew all of this from the start, but she couldn't find a way to explain it to Luna without Luna taking it personally.
@TenchiFreak5
ReplyDeleteTrue but I was thinking more of Luna wants something closer to Anarchy, not the crazy roit type, or hipsters, what the word really means; No rule, everyone's free, land of do as you please.
Which of course would fail so hard everyone would be begging for Celestia to take over again.
@Paperpony
ReplyDeleteI agree, it isn't particularly interesting, but I needed it to move the plot forward, explain a few things (e.g. why is it taking the Guard so long to track them in a small town?),and put things in perspective for a distraught Twilight (I don't want her to be an emotional wreck for the rest of the story). As you can probably tell, that section of the story seems a bit rushed. That's because it is, so it no doubt could be rewritten to be more efficient in its message and purpose. Did you find the guard to be unbelievable? That was a problem I struggled with. Also, the language is a bit...academic at times. That definitely happens to me when I'm rushing it. Anyway, it's a scene I'm considering rewriting substantially. So if anyone has anything to say about it, that would be appreciated.
Concerning the system of government, TechniFreak is right. I give the example of the Roman Republic because:
1) It took a long time for the Republic to evolve into a club for both Noble and Plebeian.
2) The pro-patrician domination of the senate until the Hortensian Law, and even after that a hundred years later you see a noble oligopoly of land (as we know land is power) that diminished the number of plebeians and thus threatened the stability of the republic.
Also, a republic in the old sense, in many ways, was a class serving institution. For instance, the Dutch Republic, in the absence of a strong nobility, instead reinforced the economic/security interests of the merchant elite (particularly in Holland), often sacrificing the interests of other provinces (other social/economic sectors) in the process (for instance, the province of Drenthe, since it was so poor, was not even allowed a vote).
At all times we must be taking into account the very limited nature of democracy and how a republic can be very class serving. It should also be taken into account how a competing source of political legitimacy (Julius Ceaser for the Roman example, the Prince of Orange in the Dutch case) were very popular among those who felt neglected by the system (a good many).
As for Luna, she has no substantive proposal to replace the system. I believe that I wrote that she flat out didn’t care and had faith that their subjects could organize and rule themselves without divine interference, which is not unreasonable.
>"Luna," she huffed as another tear streamed down her face, "sister, please! We can fix this still, I promise! Please, please, come back to me!"
ReplyDelete>"Don't you dare turn your back on me, Luna."
>"Give up little sister!" Celestia shouted, pushing Luna back.
>"Luna, repent." Celestia said with an assertive tough love, "Dear sister it's not too late. I will always forgive you."
>"…I'm sorry Luna. This is the best I can do for you…and Equestria."
-At each new chapter, I find Celestia even more pathetic and despicable in her thoughts and actions, and find myself hating her more and more (maybe not the best 'quotes' ( > ) to properly show it, but still)...
But seriously, her atitude and her character/personality, in THIS story, just make me want to punch her hard.
Just to try to knock some sense into her.
...yeah, don't currently have the best ''sentiment'' for her, right now...
Never thought of the day I would think of using the ''Trollestia'' term, when thinking about her...
It's a brilliant concept, but the dialogue feels... overly verbose in places. Still, this story managed to put serious emotional punch behind the characters. Kudos.
ReplyDeleteMan... Withdrawal...
ReplyDeleteI'm gonna go crawl into a fetal position and try to fall asleep while I wait for updates.
It's funny because Rarity and Nightmare Moon have the same voice actress.
ReplyDeleteAlso, GRAMMAR, PLEASE! Just copy and paste it into goddamn Microsoft Word, and patch up the errors! I beg you!
"a Pokemon using leer isn't lowering the others' defense because it wants to rape it"
ReplyDeleteCAN'T UNSEE.
I agree with the decision to plot out what the other three had been up to, particularly as most of the tertiary plot points (civil disorder) had so far not even really been touched upon.
And if Braveheart's coming back (which I assumed would happen anyways, but still), well, shit.
The Rarity and Storm Cloud part brought the whole chapter down.
ReplyDelete1 it's pretty clear that Equestria is a female rule nation in almost every way so Storm Cloud's comments feel rather out of place if anything it should have been the males that fought for equal rights
2 feminist does not mean 'not girly' if anything Rarity is a model feminist but that's all mote because of the above.
Also for me this may be the vison of Luna I hate the most. She comes off as one of those closed minded hippy bitchs who talk about how much they care about something but never do anything to fix the problem. Some one really needs to tell her off. Just my two cents about that anyway.
@d715
ReplyDelete1. Sexism exists all over the world, including in places that are women-run; including sexism against men by women in male-run places. Storm Cloud's comments weren't even about equal rights in the first place (she was talking about subverting traditional gender roles by joining the military), so this doesn't really matter.
2. You completely missed the point of that discussion. It didn't say "feminists aren't girly" (also known as Real Women Don't Wear Dresses).
It actually was saying "don't make assumptions based on first impressions," which Rarity and Storm Cloud both did in that scene. In fact, that scene was a satire of the sentiment you said it was portraying, because they both came to the conclusion (especially Storm Cloud, who was obviously prejudiced against Rarity in the beginning) at the end that both of them were strong female figures in their own way.
Time weirdness is weird.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, I know that there is all sorts of kangaroo court going on in Equestria, and all is not as it seems, but even if you put Luna up for a count of treason, it seems kinda dickish that Celestia put her on the Moon for 1000 to life, put together a plan to neutralize her the night she gets out, demonize her in the interim to keep the story together, and then leave her holding the bag when it falls apart. I know neither sister is going to get out of this one unscathed, but Celly kinda needs to clean up her own mess on this one.
Genius. Rarity and Nightmare Moon have the same voice actor.
ReplyDeleteI'm looking forward to seeing the Mane 6 and Luna reunite. STILL not a clue where Celestia is, or why she isn't raising the Sun.
ReplyDeleteI'm now going to return to my withdrawal as I wait for this to update again. Hopefully Past Sins will update soon. Keep up the awesome!
Oh, a new part ? If my memory serves me well, Celestia was an 'heartless control-freak, and a complete ''ass'' to her sister'... Let's see how my memories are accurate ?
ReplyDeletePart 6 :
>Lady Rarity Unicorn. >her last name "Unicorn" revealed her more humble origins
-...really ? You couldn't just say ''Rarity'', you actually had to put ''unicorn'' as an attempt for a last-name, seriously ?
If we stretch the 'table of possibilities' a bit... You could have taken ''Belle'' (from : Sweetie *Belle*, her little sister) as a more 'plausible' last-name for her.
>"Well then, 'Lady' Rarity, you are under arrest for conspiring against the throne."
-''Wait, what, why ? / Out of nowhere*'' counter : 1 (plus probably a few, if I remember the previous chapters)
>And then the prophets emerged. >Repent, we must all repent! >Doom, doom! What hope do we have!
-*facepalm* ...prophets telling the apocalypse or whatever... That was SOOooo much needed here.
Also, I don't recall ponies going all ''crazy and dumb'' the first time Nightmare Moon appeared... and 'that' time she had ACTUALLY appeared IN FRONT of them, when now it's just : ''still night''.
I could believe the ''crowd'' becoming progressively nervous in this situation, waiting for an EVENT to occur and not just a few words from the *Random Pony #38*, before escalading toward light-mild panic... But, not like a stampede of crazy-cows with bags on their head.
>"Boy, you have no idea how wrong you are. I'll make an example of you!"
-...you know what ? I think this part simply started on the wrong foot...
>To Captain Braveheart's great relief, the crowd dispersed and calmly returned to their residence
-Sorry, but... *Pointless mob was pointless* ...and this actually took about 1/3 of this part ?
>The report noted her for her honesty, but I didn't expect a simple run-in with her would give us the intelligence we needed.
-Errrg... another story doing it... For the last time : Being ''Honest'' DOESN'T mean that you can't stop or that you have to be blindly-stupidly honest(This is valid for the other Elements too) to a point were it will endanger yourself or others ! (This is the short version. I have the long one somewhere...)
>Don't worry Blackmane
-Ya forgot one...
>"You're friend conspired with Princess Luna, a traitor to both her own sister and Equestria.
-Well, I call additional nonsense here...
Events : *Night*-*Luna go away of the castle*-*Luna arrives at Twilight's house*-*Celestia disappears ''mysteriously''*... and apparently this equal in their mind : *All Elements of ''HARMONY'' are traitors* ? With the equivalent of stable/verifiable/trustworthy proofs that would equal to a drop of water in the Mojave Desert !
>Damn I need a cigar
-*Boot to the Head*
... *Tap on the screen*, yep, Equestria, not New York, Detroit, *Insert city name*... Just wanted to be sure of the planet we are currently on ...
>It's ponies like you Miss. Rarity, that reduce our entire gender to nothing but trophies
>What's worse is that this superficial crap is what young fillies aspire to do
-I agree with others... this, here, was a ***TERRIBLE*** idea ! Really... very.
I'm trying to read a STORY (fanfiction) here, not the newspaper or whatever documentary articles of 'Controversial Subject X-22b'...
This is just heavily distracting from the story (or anything else that could make the story go a bit more forward instead), and mostly make me wonder *Where the heck does THAT come from ?*.
>Perhaps you're right; maybe I'm not the model feminist.
-I think I can see the story actually going *BACKWARD* at this point !...
@Nova25
ReplyDelete... Previous parts were relatively 'ok' from what I remember. This new one was quite ''mildly'' annoying to read... I could resume it in barely 3 lines, without loosing much ''vital'' information. It may sound a 'bit' harsh, I know, but this New part simply focused on SO MUCH 'heavily distracting' stuff, and on things that slowed and didn't made the story move forward of more than an inch ...
Hmm, I wrote this story on Microsoft Word and it didn't detect anything. I do tend to write sentences with many clauses, so that may be the problem.
ReplyDeleteAs much as we may perceive Equestria to be female dominated, it ultimately reflects the attitudes our own patriarchal society. In fact, whenever males are shown in the show, they are performing a task traditionally ascribed to them. The Royal Guard is the most obvious example, but not the only one. In 'Winter Wrap Up', only male ponies are plowing the heavy snow, even Applejack is largely sidelined. In 'Sonic Rainboom' construction is performed by males (but the more pressing question is why a jackhammer is needed in a cloud city). Likewise, the railroad stallions in 'Over the Barrel' support this trend.
TechniFreak did a good job explaining the Rarity/Storm Cloud exchange. What I wanted to do with the scene was demonstrate how fate and free will impacted each pony's life. I'll probably rewrite a good deal of it.
As for Luna, I don't think her a hippie in the "do nothing" sense. She quite clearly tried to shake up the established order, only to be burned. Badly.
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ReplyDeleteI hate to be the author to reply to everything, but I really want to clear something up. Celestia is not a heartless bitch, I don't know why you guys keep thinking that. The Celestia in chapters 1 and 5 is no monster, and I don't know how many times I need to repeat Big Mac's advice to Luna:
ReplyDelete"It’s only natural an’ healthy to think ourselves right, but it can blind us to what all is actually happenin’ ‘round us. Jus’ be sure that yer not in the wrong before ya harp on others."
Thank you for pointing out some legitimate errors. I misheard the line from 'Ticketmaster' when Rarity says "...is Rarity the Unicorn". I heard "Rarity Unicorn", which I thought was strange but just took it as fact. I'll do what I can to correct it.
However, I question how closely you read the text, as many of the issues (rioting, conspiracy)were addressed and explained within the story. And yes, you could easily summarize any of the chapters of this story in a short paragraph, but it would be devoid of characterization or an exploration of ideas, which is why I'm writing this story.
@Grey Prophet
ReplyDeleteYes, yes... ''perceive Equestria to be female dominated'', etc...
All valid, persception-based, points...
But this, rather LARGE, section of this Part feels like it's being simply ''pushed'' in our face, with maybe 'a little too much' insistence, really.
No need to drag the point painfully and in details, on such a distance.
@Sun Ray
ReplyDeleteThey still mostly are... plus they are 'ok' about brutalizing the main cast (Bearers of the Elements of HARMONY), based on 'shaky' assumptions, to get to Luna...
Gah Lightning Strike is so, sooo melodramatic. I've liked most of this but it was hard to get through chapter 5. No one talks like that, and I really, really reccomend going back through all his dialogue in Ch. 5 and revising for realism. He reads like a bad romance novel.
ReplyDeleteOtherwise, this was mostly good.
I may have more comments later but excellent job with Ajax his hate seemed both very real and deep as well as(at least from his perspective), justified.
ReplyDeleteChapter 7 was well done and I feel the quality of story telling is rising.
ReplyDeleteAs someone who spent time in the military and then in law enforcement I feel the Royal Guard is getting a bad wrap.
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ReplyDeleteI'm actually pretty happy with the Royal Guard characterization.
ReplyDeleteGiven the situation, they're acting like they're supposed to. (IMO, of course)
After all, you don't negotiate (nor ask first, act later) when you got a possible (or certain, in the view of the Royal Guard) tyrant, psychopath and mass murderer on the loose.
Hay, with the characterization that Celestia gave Luna/Nightmare Moon across the years, Cpt. Braveheart could just raze Ponyville entirely in his search for Luna and the collateral damage would still be acceptable.
Ah, horseapples, I'll go as far as saying that I condone Braveheart's actions. He's an A class officer.
Trying to revert a crisis in a worst-case scenario, having to protect Celestia's secret weapon and keep order in Ponyville... While still being an inspiring leader to those following him?
No wonder he's with the Elite.
I'll leave more military/politic/whatever commenting later since I'm starting chpt. 7 now. So far, fantastic read!
Honestly? I don't know what to think of anymore. There's nothing wrong with the story per se, but it just doesn't seem to have a sense of direction anymore.
ReplyDeleteDon't get me wrong, getting the background information for the Royal Guard and all that is nice, but the problem is that the story didn't initially present itself as being about them. It was, for the first 5 chapters or so, about the Luna/Celestia quagmire, and now it seems to be getting too complex for its own good. Having characters like Braveheart be presented as more tragic, complex characters makes them more interesting, but I don't think spending an entire chapter on them does the story any favors. Particularly not when (for the most part) it covers stuff that could have arguably been guessed to end up happening.
For example, we already knew Prince Douche in this story was at top form with his Douche powers from the very beginning, so a quarter chapter dedicated to him continuing a personal vendetta (and having the backstory to said vendetta dumped in our laps in the same chapter, no less) against a character we already knew a good deal about anyways doesn't really add anything to the story.
I also think (and, hell, I might be in a huge minority about this, so ignore it if that turns out to be the case) it was a really, really poor decision to shoehorn Discord into this. I think it would have been much better to just let this rest as a Season 1 story and ride it out rather than take a big gamble to shove Season 2 themes/characters/whatever into it and hope that Season 2 being in progress still doesn't screw everything up before the story is even finished anyways.
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ReplyDelete...perhaps you're right, this story does lack clear direction. To be fair though, it always kind of has. I'd like to say that it's sympotimatic of the nature of the story (no one really has any idea what's going on), but more likely poorly developed writing skills play the greater part. Would you recommend omitting Braveheart's scene altogether?
ReplyDeleteI am not going to adjust this story to the entirety of season two, only to the brief (and murky) history laid out by Celestia. Discord's rule helps to rule out the fact the sisters were always princesses of Equestria, that they had to intervene to restore harmony. It also serves as the basis for Luna to be able to yearn for the days before their rule without looking like an irresponsible fool.
I just hope to see an update soon, instead of all this worry about going back and changing something 95% of the readers won't go back and re-read. I'm loving the story, and I'm happy with it so far, but I want to see chapters and progression, not intermissions of musigs over what might have been wrong about the old chapters.
ReplyDelete'
My philosophy, take the criticisms and points of view as you go, use them to grow in your new writing, but keep progressing forward. Right now it looks like the creative wheels are spinning without moving forward. Don't dig a rut you can't get out of!
If you want to fix the story, that's fine, but do the rewrite once it's complete. If you stop to fix every mistake or fix every weak point in the already released chapters now, you'll never be able to move forward with the new chapters! It's already a harsh enough stutter to read chapters with such gaps between, if the gaps grow due to rewrites, it'll be more excruciating. If you save a rewrite for the end, when it's all complete, you reward new and old viewers with a chance to see the refined work as a single read session.
That's my two bits anyway.
Well... Reading that little self reflection/explanation bit makes it sound like you're contemplating rewrites anyway.
ReplyDeleteUse the feedback to better your writing, but don't stop moving forward.
I've seen too many good things take to long and peter out before completion. I'm a bit paranoid about that. I'm having withdrawals over Paradise, which hasn't seen an update in close to a month after blasting out chapters.
I just want to see some forward progression! I love this story, and I certainly hope to learn more about the past. Ponyville under siege by overbearing guards is overtaking the original draw of the story, the conflict between Luna and the image Celestia seems to have portrayed her in over the last millennium. Luna's apparent loss of her mortality, and what actually happened in the past.
It was that original conflict in the castle that propelled this story to epic grandeur. Don't forget it. If I wan to see a small village under siege, I can just turn on CNN and find out what our latest Afghanistan mission is all about.
I've been thoroughly enjoying this story for the most part, however, I have a few complaints. First and foremost is Braveheart's cursing. It really takes away from the [Normal] feel of the story. There are ways of maintaining such an attitude without resorting to PG-13 and R rated language. While I wouldn't have any problem with that sort of thing elsewhere, language much stronger than "bucking" or "what the hay" really breaks out of the normal FiM universe for the reader.
ReplyDeleteAnother slight issue I have is that at times the story verges on [Dark], despite not being labeled as such. It's not too bad, but I'm still not sure if Big Mac getting beat within an inch of his life, among other things, fits solely within the confines of the [Normal] tag.
I must say I really enjoyed pt.8 . It was nice seeing some background on the secondary (?) characters and some ponyfication of the EAF/Royal Guard.
ReplyDeleteMorning Star's scene was also intriguing. Makes me wonder not only what happened after the incident, but also Morning Star's role in it and her fate.
However, I agree that placing Discord in the story was, if not a bad decision, a very precipitated one. If anything, it could have waited a bit.
Also, this chapter has left quite some plot points (Blueblood/Braveheart, Ruby and Blizzard, the Equestrian Government...) that I'd love to see explored, but, as said, not in favor of the main plot.
TL,DR: Bucking awesome, eager to read more!
hate to ask but can we get this on google docs?
ReplyDeleteI hate to ask but can we get this with an actual chapter 9?
ReplyDeleteI'm enjoying the story (maybe 8/10?), but I'd greatly prefer if you followed Luna more closely. The departure with Braveheart was pretty distracting... I don't mind him being redeemed, but I prefer it in little gestures like his response to pinkie pie or acceptance of Rarity's complaints, or though other characters like big mac's saying he was just doing his job. This story is not about Braveheart (I'm pretty sure) and I can't imagine his role requires this much exploration into his origins and psyche.
ReplyDeleteMore nightmares and shadows from Luna's past, a more explanation as to Morning Star's role in regards to the two princesses (as she seems to be nearly as close to the heart of the story as the princesses are), and maybe a bit more obvious foreshadowing in regards to stuff like the parallels between Celestia's previous and present disappearance.
I can't wait to learn how her disappearance was the appropriate answer to this crisis, especially given Luna is far from being either insane or willing to abdicate again... at least at this juncture.
PS. I love the sand mare bit. I would love to see other divine night magic... maybe stuff like the ability to pull the stars from the sky, to command ursa minors or other runaway constellations, shadowmancy, command of the moon, the ability to negate even the most stable of enchantments in this world of her own creation (like by taking away the ability of pegasi to fly for a short while or in a small area), awing others with her ability to conjure visages of divine beauty and radiance... you've painted her as the source and patron of inspiration and creativity. The fight with the dragon, featuring some dodging, a magic shield and the gravity trick she'd previously displayed, was a little underwhelming.
Also: I don't get the Celestia hate. She has good reason to want to maintain power... she treasures their creations and doesn't want to see them struggle and die for hundreds to thousands of years as they try again and again to get it right.
ReplyDeleteShe feels responsible to protect them and no longer feels comfortable with the idea of playing in the clouds so far away from their creations as if they no longer mattered to them. She has her duty as the entire race’s parent and doesn’t feel they are ready for freedom quite yet, all the more so since last time a horrible civil war broke out. Perhaps worse would be if they acted out against the other nations… anything they do to others, in her mind, is her fault for making them imperfect and not raising them right.
Are the people actually oppressed under her reign? Are they unhappy? What do they really have to gain? We don't even know who the civil war was fought with other than it was started, originally, by Luna's actions. It was cruel to demonize her, but like in 1984, it helped the people to unite and eventually uphold Celestia as their supreme, unquestionable leader. It's a lot of checks and balances with unsavory ponies that, when given an ounce of power, see fit to abuse it again and again... but at least they are loyal to her. Without a truly benevolent ruler the entire system WOULD be prone to amazing amounts of corruption and greed.
In the end she sought to bury the past not because of fear of being discovered but, more likely, due to the shame she felt because of it and the desire for the grievances of the past to no longer be remembered in the present. She doesn’t want Luna demonized now… it serves no purpose and was done in large part because Luna wasn’t around to be demonized in anything other than memory.
Who can say why she disappeared? Possibly she was previously unaware of Luna’s mortality she could have actually dropped everything to fly off and try and discover how to get Luna’s immortality back. She could have been attacked. It could be part of a plan to have Luna struggle against forces Celestia is confidant she can overcome (she can turn into shadows and smoke, teleport and put an entire troop in a deep sleep with minimal effort, after all), then return and declare her a champion of some kind. At worst Celestia is allowing Luna an abject lesson in exactly what would have happened if she had left with Luna that day in the past… Though it kinda undermines her point to be doing just what she said she would never do, Celestia might have promised herself a long while back that, should the topic come up, she would allow ponies to die if it would help Luna to understand.
Celestia really has no reason to want her sister hurt, imprisoned or dead. Other than if she’s just evil and thought now was a good time to do it. Something that wouldn’t make for a very good story, to be honest.
Why did that Author's Note section sound so incredibly condescending?
ReplyDeleteI really liked chapter 9 and the history behind an underrated character, but I have to ask this: is story of the girl being sacrificed foreshadowing, because this is going to be a repeat of Eversleep where one of the mane 6 dies, count me out. I like ponies specifically because they're one of the things I like that aren't grimdark.
ReplyDeleteAlso, I got how Morning Star/Lucifer parallel. The name kind of gave it away.
@Joestar
ReplyDeleteI'm sorry about my last set of notes...I wrote them quite some time ago when I was very frustrated. I did not mean to insult anyone's intelligence but only curb the nasty private messages I get.
@Hexplosion
None of the canon characters will die, no worries, though this story is already quite dark anyways...
I changed the tag from normal to dark, but, umm, I guess it hasn't been updated...
A few things about the part 10
ReplyDelete"We often cite Braveheart for abusing Big Mac's civil rights via search and seizure/brutality, and indeed he did so excessively. But Big Mac was also violating the law by harboring a dangerous fugitive and assaulting law enforcers."
Consider that the first time we see him he's vulgar and sounds less like he's trying to save Equestria and more like he's happy for a a chance to hurt ponies, this never is remedied and perhaps a more subdued character would have worked. Also, we already know Luna's innocent so it isn't like we have room to doubt that Big Mac did a good thing. You haven't done a good job presenting either side as equally wrong or right.
"What he does he earnestly believes is for the common good and security of Equestria, just like the other characters. He does not get off on pain and cruelty, indeed he uses threats, insults and intimidation to avoid engaging in such activities."
At least two of those attributes are counterproductive to defusing hostile situations.
Liked Chpt. 9
ReplyDeleteIt was nice to see some background on Zecora and the zebra lands. Even though it WAS a static chapter, it was well worth a read and fitted the rest of the story.
Also, I like the "greyness" of the characters. So far, every single "ideology" (Celestia's absolutism, Luna's ultra-liberalism, Royal Guard's use of force, Twilight's pacifism...) and the characters that follow it have very good backing arguments - and also good counter-arguments.
I like it.
@Benschachar
I don't think Braveheart is the kind of guy to "defuse" a situation...
He's more the kind of guy to roll over any hostilities with the (excessive) use of force.
And uh... From our constant experiences here in Brazil, I can tell you, most of the times, it works pretty well.
This was a much better chapter than 8, getting us back involved with the main story while still involving the tertiary subplots. I particularly liked Luna's incredulity at the idea that her own skills and personality made her better at something that she couldn't fathom Celestia not being better at.
ReplyDelete@Benschachar
He genuinely cares, but the only way he knows how to get things done is through outright violence and intimidation. That being said, I agree with what you are saying overall, and that brings me to my next point:
I have one thing I would like to say, and that is that the most recent chapters have been getting extremely unsubtle in how they deal with the themes they are trying to cover. Early chapters, the ones that dealt with Luna's concept of self-rule and Celestia's desire to protect her subjects from it were much more smooth in how they played out. Everything was still shades of grey, but they were woven into the story. Luna wanted/was manipulated into wanting complete freedom, and it blew up in her face. Celestia wanted to protect everyone from corruption, and it turned Luna against her. This was shown by the events of the story and the events of the flashback to when Luna was banished.
Lately however, the story seems to go along this path:
Character A says why moral concept is one way.
Character B says why moral concept is some other way.
They argue for a few paragraphs, leave each other in a huff and then something immediately happens in the story that proves both of them wrong.
With the Rarity feminism thing a couple of chapters ago, it caught my attention but I figured it was alright at the time because Rarity is outspoken anyways, so it wouldn't be OoC for her to go on a big yelling rant about such a topic when she was already pissed off.
However, then there was the thing about Braveheart, which was even less subtle (fascist police state vs. riots) and much more jarring, and it happened again in this chapter when Twilight went on her rant about whether the ends ever justify the means. Now, granted, Twilight was sleep deprived and she's been acting like a bitch as a result for a few chapters now; but even then the entire scene seemed extremely heavy-handed to me. Like you are forcing these concepts into the story when they either already implied (Twilight's rant, Braveheart's reasoning behind his actions) and just need to be alluded to rather than outright dropped in the reader's lap, or they are being shoved in because they sorta fit the rest of the themes rather than advance the story (Rarity's thing); and it makes the story fall on the wrong side of Show, Don't Tell.
Particularly in the case of Braveheart, where we are told to believe something about him that contrasts heavily with what is actually going on in the story.
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ReplyDeleteI quickly re-checked (quickly) the last Part I had read (Part 6, apparently), just to refresh my memory, and... It seems different. Was it edited (it does seem to have... changed slightly, if not significantly for some ''details'') ?
ReplyDeleteWere other parts edited too, and to what extent ?
-----
Part 7 : (forgot to add what Part I just read.)
>Немезида должна
-Hmmm... looks like Russian... Let's see :
« To think that my nemesis has unwittingly enter (...) »
Yes, that was Russian. (Heh, a Russian dragon :) )
>Faithfully I have done so with the promise that someday you would return to your accursed wood and I could at last exact my vengeance!"
-Huh... where was he when Nightmare Moon DID came back in Episode 1... traveled a bit around Ponyville, around the Everfree Forest, and in the Old Castle ?
He forgot to set his alarm clock or something ?
>"You can't tame the weather here, this is Everfree, it's unenchanted!"
-''Unenchanted'' isn't equal to ''Anti-magic'' you know ?
You still can do magic there or, say, condense moisture in the lower atmosphere in order to create clouds...
>Ain't got nothin' to do with findin' Celestia.
-Oh yeah... Gathering super powerful, ancient artefacts(Bearers) has nothing to do with find a ''lost'' deity, riiiight ?
I will put that on the fact that AJ is currently distressed by Big Mac's situation, and thus isn't thinking clearly.
>She was ready to sacrifice mah brother jus' to escape arrest.
-...and the destruction of the PLANET! , but she doesn't know that part isn't it ?
>"Pa had been crushed under the tree after jus' managin' to push Muddy outta the way"
-Death by being crushed by a bucked tree... I know it sound all ''normal-farm''-like event, but it's far from the best explanation I have heard for AJ's parent(s) death.
Also... why the hell is he telling that story NOW of all moments, while the ''apocalypse'' is almost going on outside ? It's not like it's a side-quest or anything (RPGs' rule #?, reference).
>Every day she sat in her room wallowin' in her grief
-Ahh... So 'that' is what ponies wallow in... Gotta tell that to Rarity, next time they see her.
> But I couldn't straight up lie to a soldier…it was jus' too hard!"
-Yeeeeah, no... Honesty, yes, but it doesn't exactly work that way. Being the Element of Honesty doesn't mean that she can't lie; it means that she has a much stronger tendency to be honest *when it counts and doesn't threaten the life of other people !*. (aka : Good willed Honesty VS Blind-100% Pure-Honesty)
>The princess is suffering a combination of heat exhaustion and shock
>she needs to get to shelter and be warmed up to a proper temperature.
-Huh ? Should it be ''cooled down *slowly* to a proper temperature'' ?
Part 8 :
ReplyDelete>It was thus a ceaseless and tireless effort to maintain order among the city's population of doomsayers, opportunists, and the majority just caught up in the wave of hysteria.
-Apparently, if Celestia is missing for more than 24H, a biological switch inside ALL ponies goes to ON... and the Apocalypse starts... Huh ?
>to risk his pegasis' safety
-''pegasi'' is already plural. Shouldn't it be '' pegasi's '' ? (small error)
>The moon demon did not even have enough respect to end his life
-Yeeeah... Important army figure with ''suicidal-like'' tendencies...
Quick ! Hide the Big Red Buttons and the Nukes, before he ''honorably'' sacrifices a chunk of the world to complete his mission.
>he could not help but wonder why the goddess would permit even this small stain of gross hedonism to taint her holy seat on earth.
-*Nod*... We finished to hide all the nukes, right ? Good...
>to pick up on his pegasis' feelings
-''pegasi'' is already plural. Shouldn't it be '' pegasi's '' ? (small error)
>The city is burning for Celestia's sake!"
-I seriously doubt it's 'THAT' bad, really.
>"Ha! So much for that little rabble of mouthy do-nothings!" Braveheart jeered
-That 'Braveheart' really looks like the kind of Big Military Guy that, in movies, always end up badly (sometimes as a villain), because he decided that 'the end justified the means'... Like blasting/killing half a town to get the leader of the Resistance, counting it has 'acceptable losses', or stuff like that.
>He had to be mistaken, Celestia would never intrude into politics…
-A ruler not ruling, and that would have no political power ? ...yeeeah, no. That 'Ruby' has cotton candy for brain.
>and hierarchy makes him think Celestia is at the top of the ladder.
>he could never dream of understanding democracy
-You know, you can have a monarchy AND a democracy at the same time, kinda. It's called : 'Constitutional monarchy'... But, I guess she's not aware 'this' exist ?
>All those years at university weren't for nothing.
-*facehoof* ...let me guess.
From the look of it, the author is trying to pull the ''University people are dream-filled idealists, and Military people are power-hungry control-freaks bent on dominating everyone'' thing, isn't it ?
>"You fucking son of a bitch, you probably smacked the evil back into her!
-I say ? It's probably the only sensible thing he has said so far ?
>I will smack you so hard δενάλογο will feel it!
-Random word in random language, because... ? ...'20% cooler' ?
>the recent break down of the government has forced me to declare absolute martial law.
-Again, that was fast ?
>I'm sorry that I placed it in medieval Equestria
-...From what we see in the series of Equestria, their state of development is NOT medieval, really. With the plastics, electronics, fans, DJ stations, sewing machines, trains... they are more like between the 'Renaissance Era' and the 'near Modern time'.
We must keep in mind that they may not have focused their researches on the same fields as us... the 'Military' field being a good example.
Considering they have magic at their disposal, and that ponies are rather peaceful, normally... It would mostly explain the soldiers/guards in sword&armor.
Part 9 :
ReplyDelete>when you're friends are here
-''your'' (small error)
>I'm afraid to use complex magic in Everfree. It's…too natural.
-Too... natural... ? Seriously ?
If it would be ''natural'', it would be ''normal''... A dark green tree is still a tree, while a monster-tree isn't a tree ; it's a monster.
Whatever happened in/to the Everfree Forest, to make it that way, ''may'' have left some residual stuff, maybe something like ''static'', but I doubt it would 'interfere' with the spell or the result...
Though it might make the spell harder to cast, take more energy to focus(think) while casting ; you wouldn't end up summoning a fish while casting a fireball, nor would you get a fireball 10times the intended size.
>The lieutenant must have suffered exposure to some serious radiation.
-*facehoof* Please... don't tell me the author is gonna pull something like ''Sonic Rainboom are radioactive!''... that would be dumb.
Especially, since last time I checked rainbows weren't radioactive... even when pushed by a shockwave at high speed.
>"Of this frozen war I do not wish to speak of.
-A 'cold war' between the ponies and zebras ? ...is it something like, maybe, a reference to FO:EQ ?
>my nana used to say
-Nana ? ...is it like ''Granny'' ? Meh, 'granny' sounds better (and Pinky Pie usually say 'granny (Pie)', in the series, anyway).
>she wished too that their dilemma could be solved by talking it out.
-Oh, it ''can'' be solved by talking, technically... *cough* Errm, well, you just need 'superior firepower'. That usually makes the other side a bit more 'willing' to listen. ;)
>For this reason in your country it is banned
>"That sounds pretty sketchy, Zecora...
>"Your opinion I did not request," the zebra replied defensively
-What, she uses ''illegal drugs'' or something ? ...I don't see what interest this is to the story, really ? I mean, to state and insist that it's ''illegal'' stuff from Zecora's country...
>"Okay, okay, sorry Zecora. I'm in deeper with the authorities than you are, don't sweat it.
-*Raise an eyebrow* ...''illegal drugs'', ''authorities'' ?... I'm not sure what message the author is trying to pass here.
>and succeeded in poisoning Miss. Sparkle's mind, one we had initially presumed to be incorruptible.
-Yeeeah... I don't know why, but I can't seem to be able to take that ''poisoning'' excuse of them seriously. 'This' comes to mind : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFCyQQXFicc
>her signature 'Sonic Rainboom' and sent me hurdling from the skies blind
-A wave of (dense) moisture and reflected light, pushed by a shockwave of (compressed) air, does NOT induce radiations !
The hit from the shockwave or the landing ''might'' have induced a (temporary) cecity, but not radiation as Zecora said earlier.
@Nova25
ReplyDelete>The world teeters on the brink of destruction
-...? You know, maybe it's just me, but... Last time Nightmare Moon came, the entirety of the pony population didn't seem to lose their brain, become rioting animals, and start attacking and destroying everything in sight.
I mean, even when Discord came... there was probably a bit of fear, anxiety, anger (confusion too), but NOTHING Kingdom-shattering like the author is trying to make it sounds like ? Especially since all this is happening, barely since... what ? 24-48H ? 3 days max. ?
(to be noted that ponies aren't humans... or headless chickens, for what it matter)
>"Bloody esoteric egg heads," >What is good is just, what is evil is unjust, a foal could tell you that! It only goes to show how corrupt you are!"
-Yes, yes... Big Bad Military is bad and blind and dumb, they think they are always right and doing what's good, blabla etc, we get this now... (sigh)
I say, that whole vision/excuse of ''ALL can ONLY be 100% Pure Good/true OR 100% Pure Evil/lies. No middle or compromises can exist.'' is mildly annoying, and kinda old...
It's always kinda annoying when I see 'this' used in movies or series, etc...
>"You're right about that! You're the disciple of Nightmare Moon now, every word you speak is another drop of poison! One act of kindness will not buy my allegiance
>This is all probably part the demon's plot to ensnare me, but she won't! Not this soldier!"
-...overusing the ''paranoid military'' thing, at this point, no ?
>The ponies then were simple creatures, yes, but they were kind, loving, happy, and free from the sins and burdens of what Celestia called civilization.
>The ponies were too accustomed and dependent on her sister's artificial constructs, those incessant, complex machines of government and economy.
-Sooo... Luna, here, in THIS story is a ''pony'' wanting other ponies to return to (essentially) ''prehistoric/natural'' state, and that hates technology ? As if she was some sort of extreme 'Anarcho-primitivism' ?
*headdesk* Why, author! Why!
>unfortunately...ponies tend to love security more than freedom.
-You know... (sigh) if the author is trying to make Luna look like she's dumb and blind to the realities of their world... he's doing a DAMN fine job ! (still, it's getting progressively annoying)
-----
I usually prefer to not write my 'end-story theories', but... Meh, I don't know. Anyway, here's their 'basic frame' :
1) All this is a clever, yet somewhat cruel, plan of Celestia... to go missing, for her sister Luna to save(find) her, thus restoring ponies' trust in Luna (as the savior of Celestia and harmony).
2) All this is an ugly and clever plan of Celestia... to go ''mysteriously'' missing, causing panic and chaos in the kingdom, as an indirect way to show Luna what would happen if she (or they) would happen to leave the ponies alone.
#1 is better, but both aren't really that appealing...
Also, I personally dislike this version of Luna... ''hating technology, and the concept of civilization'', because APPARENTLY 'not being dumb and living under a roof' = 'horrifying break of freedom' and other nonsense like that. Not the most interesting ''version'' of Luna, that I have seen.
What nova said
ReplyDeleteAlso the reccent bach of notes sounds like you took a bathroom breaks during the third act because you failed to meantion the fact that human history does not have ice monsters that feed on hate and can only be beaten back with friendship.
Also I'm pretty sure the show is making it clear that Celestia and Luna are not gods rather two ponies with godlike powers. I'm calling Discord turned them into the ponies sybloms of unity to show just how powerful he is (and it would be funny)
Also @Nova
ReplyDeleteFunny thing about that in real life ponies see security as freedom (as in the freedom to do stuff without the fear of being eaten) In other words they would think this Luna is tring to get them killed.
@d715
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure to really understand what you wanted to say ?
...anyway...
The series *never* pointed anywhere around Celestia and/or Luna 'not' being goddesses-princesses.
Also, something that is probably a mishmash of various quotes I heard a different places (games, books, animes, series, etc...), plus a touch of philosophy : What is a god, if not a being of unbelievable power, so much that it seems there's virtually no way to attain/reach their level ?
...then again, there's many, many, maaaaany variations of what a 'god/goddess' can be (and their characteristics) depending on games, books, animes, series, etc...
@Sun Ray
ReplyDeleteIndeed it is, it's just taking longer than I thought...
Do remember that posting what is essentially a giant author's note as a chapter goes against ff.net rules. You're risking a potential story removal by keeping it there.
ReplyDeleteHad forgotten about this fic.....
ReplyDeleteJust caught up from chap 7 to 10.....
Fic YUMMY....
NEED MOAR NAO! :O
I love your charaterization and the nearly cruel emotional rollercoasters you force every single pony in the entire damn story to go through. Don't fret about OCs either; yours are great!
Sad to see you need to address some messages in the fashion you spoke of in your notes. I sensed no real negative vibes in your writing.
Did you decide against using the sister sun, sister moon poem?
ReplyDeleteHow come the wounded (male) guard outflies Rainbow Dash who is fine? Dude people already think you're sexist stop digging that hole.
ReplyDeleteAlso what kind of insane logic made Applejack think that she was wrong about Luna, all that prooved was they have some of Luna's powers not that Luna's is trustworthly.
@Nova 25
yeah sorry I kinda ramble
@swicked
ReplyDeleteOh, you're right, it's not there. Maybe I added it to the posting on FIM and not the FF...Anyhow it will be put up.
Well, it has been 2months since last chapter. Surely, the author got ‘better’ at handling and the quantity of some of the more ‘’touchy’’ elements put in this story (instead of dropping the whole Salt cellar. Salt poisoning, a serious issue.)... let’s see if it is so...
ReplyDeleteCH.10 :
>I kick-started this baby, but Everfree took it and made its own! Just take a look at these snowflakes!" >"They all look the same!
-Huh... The Everfree Forest is VERY well known for its ‘’unnatural self-regulation’’ of its weather (normal, non-pegasi controlled weather... maybe just a touch more intense/extreme, but still ‘’normal’’)... Last time I looked outside, each snowflake looked different.
>"...okay Carrot Top,"
-Saying that at AJ or ? ...because I don’t think THE Carrot Top(pony) is here, and AJ doesn’t have orange/redhair.
>meaning that she would be slowing down the .
-Missing word at the end ?
>She's a pony no better than anypony else...goddess or not, Lady Justice sees not a single difference.
-Yeeeeah, right ?... but if she dies, it’s the ‘End of the World!’. But, I guess AJ forgot/doesn’t know that part ?
Also, I’m guessing AJ never heard of the ‘Presumption of innocence’ principle ?
Also #2, she has some strange ways to describe her *friend* RD ?
...speaking of goldfish... Didn’t Big Mac talk to AJ about not going all ‘hateful-crazy’ like that, in previous chapter ? No ? Maybe ?
... Almost skipping a few sentences of AJ’s complains, I mean *whining* at this point. I mean, yeah, after the first 30 lines or so, I got the idea, sheeesh? She DEEPLY hates Luna to a point of becoming illogical and blind, because... well, ‘’because’’ Big Mac was hurt trying to protect Luna, and now she’s going coo-coo-crazy on every living thing(kinda) ...
>"No, Ah'm just right, that's all." Applejack coldly replied, "Rainbow Ah can't follow you. Ah just can't trust your judgment anymore than Ah can lasso and hogtie it. Ah'll find my own path to Everfree Castle..."
-Ok now, she’s just being dumb on purpose...
‘’I don’t like you trusting a pony I don’t like, so I’m not gonna trust you, and I will go lose myself in this dark and creepy forest...’’...IN THE MIDDLE OF A BLIZZARD!
Did she hit her head on a low branch again ? Or, did she encounter Discord itself off-screen, or something ?
>This was her path, the right path
-The ONLY path ! ...Funny... I’ve heard quite a few crazy people and dictators say/convinced of the same thing. Not a good sign.
>"I didn't listen to mah brother, I abandoned Rainbow a few miles back, and I disrespected them both because I let mah arrogance best me again...
-Yes, yes, and double-yes... It just took her about half of this Chapter, to realise this...
Also, she’s saying all this in front of the lair of a beast ready to eat her... I would be running TOO, if I were her, just in case. (Hats don’t tend to satiate giant spider-beast for very long. It went after the hat, really ?)
@Nova25
ReplyDelete>Though the ancient arachnid had abandoned its burrow to its better, there festered no semblance of resentment in the tarantulion's simple mind. The laws of nature could not be challenged, might was always right.
-Actually one line that sounds good. I mean, about the reaction of the spider-beast.
>and yeah, it really did hurt to hear the honest truth.
-I wouldn’t call her earlier ‘clouded judgement’... ‘’truth’’, but whatever.
>Besides, I like to take credit for my own near-death experiences, thank you very much.
-Could only sound right, if coming from RD, yeah. A few more like that, and it should counter-act the LARGE amount of AJ’s whining(half this chapter is just that, seriously.).
>"Geez, cut it out with the humility thing already. It's getting old fast, okay?" Rainbow interrupted
-I wouldn’t have said exactly ‘’humility’’, but... RD is absolutely right.
>Ah can't let go of my hate for her...for Luna. She only leaves a trail of misery behind her
-...mostly because everypony is ‘’apparently’’ just SOOO damn focused on being suspicious about her, hating/disliking her, trying to kill her (between other things)... Not really her fault, really.
>they failed to take notice of a red bird perched above the cave quietly priming its plumage before taking off once more into the night sky.
-Philomina ? ...mmh, it’s curious yes, but it doesn’t add much for my first theory or the other.
-----
Well, it was... an ‘ok’ chapter. I, personally, find the second half SO MUCH better than the first half, for various reasons... but, that’s just me. I would even say that the second half was a refreshing change for the first half... too much salt ruins a dish, you know ?
Psssh... All this nitpicking and "okay chapter" stuff. This was great. It really made your characterization of Applejack 100% more human (pony?) that the words of her brother only took her so far. She had to have her own experiences to change her mind. I'm glad you added this, even though I can't wait to get back to the main story! Please, please, please don't make us wait so long for the next chapter! Thanks. :D
ReplyDelete@Macon Mixx
ReplyDelete>Psssh... All this nitpicking and "okay chapter" stuff.
-You know, last time I checked it wasn't mandatory to kiss the boots of an author ?
The goal of a **Comment** isn't to be 100% praise, you know ? Neither is it to be 100% 'dislike'... it's a balance between both, but not necessarily 50/50 each time.
Everything, both on the readers and author side, is a question of perception and interpretation... and an occasion to learn or take note of something.
@Nova25
ReplyDeleteWhat I must have skipped it (or the writer added it in) But why the fuck is the Everfree Winter while its suppost to be snowing? The Everfree's whole point is that's its just a normal forest (for us) ie when its spring in Equestria its spring there.
You know this story is a whole lot better if this was really just some shitty peom Luna has been reading to all her goth friends and it all ends with Celestia going down in the basement with a plate of cookies.
That or Luna really was Nightmare moon and in guilt she asked Celestia to alter her mind, which is why she never notic like anything about Nightmare moon for over a year, namly the national holiday named after her evil side.
Because that is what the writer had in mind, Luna not facing up to her action and Celestia doing anything for the ponies she loves
(I've talked to him and suggested this ammong others like:
Played up the ideal that the guards are all green to the gilled. Like the Canterlot roit was because they botched up and Braveheart blames Luna because it avoids blaming himself.
Make a mane six (I suggested Dash) a noble (but not a black sheep type rather how most act) to show Luna how much things have change and rethink some of her bitching mindset.
And of course stop the sexist undertone. I mean really, everything a guy does something is either played down or blamed on a woman
So, wait, just like that Braveheart's on the good side?
ReplyDeleteI am so glad to see an update to this story. Totally awesome!
ReplyDelete@d715
ReplyDeleteWhat was addressed to who, in all that ?
Just read through all the chapters.
ReplyDeleteWow. Just wow.
I need to read moar. NOW!!!!!! :)
CH.11 :
ReplyDelete>Pinkie fed off the energy of others like a lovable, poofy tape worm
-Not to complain about this... ‘’nice’’... imagery, but I believe ‘’sponge’’ would be a much proper and ‘accurate’ word to use there.
... The ‘’personas’’ inside Pinky Pie seem like an odd addition, honestly. At least, the way they are now, mostly because... how to say this... of how they ‘clash’ with Pinky Pie (their style, actions...). They don’t seem to ‘clearly’ personify the different facets of Pinky Pie (their different ‘’personalities’’ should be more clearly cut, less vague). Maybe it’s just me ? (Also, I found it a bit hard to follow) ...
>The three turned in shock to see the street performer light a cigarette in silent satisfaction.
-The heck ? Damn ‘’cigarettes’’ now ? ...really.
Those ‘things’ serve no purpose and do not add anything in stories, unless there’s a POINT to them !
Random insertion of ‘That, and drugs’, just because, do not make things more ‘cool’ or better or interesting, unless they have a reason to be... which they don’t, especially in the MLP:FiM universe... (sigh...)
>and found the same helplessness and pain that I've seen before in beached whales.
-Huh ? She has been to the ocean recently (1-2years) ? ...that’s new ?
And to say that always I thought she had lived between Cloudsdale and Ponyville, all her life (except for that one story, where she goes in vacation to the beach with the others), in the series...
>"De sang et l'esprit différentes, mais sœurs au destin,vous et je."
>"Of different blood and spirit, yet sisters in destiny, you and I."
-Should be : ‘’De sang et d’esprit différents, toutefois sœurs sont destinées, vous et moi.’’
Heh... Chevalais, for Français... The word sounds right.
>Once the cookies and punch, everypony went lights out.
-Once the cookies and punch...what ? ...‘were eaten’ / ‘vanished’ / ‘served’ ? (missing word ?)
>It was awesome, pezuña a pezuña
-As much as those random insertions of different languages are ‘fancy’... I don’t quite see the reason (for some of them, at least) ?
>I can't thank you enough returning!
-‘’for returning’’, maybe ? (missing word ?)
>The rest of the guard seized each of the six and put swords to throats.
-They are in Zecora’s hut, if I remember correctly, no ? I don’t recall her leaving the hut recently, so... where is she supposed to be again ?
>That's a business secret property of Mr. and Mrs. Cake and Sugar Cube Corner, a subsidiary of Cake Enterprises Incorporated!
-In the future, she’s gonna own her very own Candy Factory, just you wait. :)
>To be honest sir, I'm on the sane boat as you
-‘’same’’, or it’s a ‘play on the word’ ? (small error ?)
... Suddenly, ass-crazy-Braveheart becomes good-‘level-headed’-reasonable-Braveheart ? Huhhh, ok ? The transition between the 2 states seems pretty fast ...
>You make Rainbow Dash look like a Mother Thracia!
-Thracia ? ...like Mother Teresa ? I don’t see the comparison.
>We're really, really sorry about messing up your house. Won't do it again. Thanks for everything.
-They don’t even propose to pay for the damages ? Indeed, ‘terrible guests’.
Also, it seems I missed the -1 line- saying that Zecora had gone searching for herbs ? ...it’s not like it had been said more than a single time, before the very end of this part.
-----
It was... an ‘ok’ part. Relatively interesting... though the scene in Pinky’s head was a bit weird, and not exactly the good ‘Pinky Pie weird’, I would say.
@Nova25 Awww... Sorry N25. Didn't mean that as a personal attack. Just being flippant, per usual. I do agree that the chapter got better towards the end, but I felt like calling it an 'ok' chapter was just selling it a little bit short. Characters need time to work through their problems to be believable....
ReplyDeleteSpeaking of which brings us up to this chapter! I can't imagine how else it would have happened, but I'm not the author so that's not really my problem. But did anyone else think that Braveheart came over kinda easy? Perhaps not. The Philomina bit was well-emphasized as being interpreted by all as a sign of Celestia's will. And his talking with the younger guardmember helped, I think. But it still seemed like there was something missing. It was okay, though. If nothing else, the "on edge"-ness of it made the chapter more suspenseful.
One thing I did LOVE about this chapter was Pinkie! You did well in chapter 9 (I think?) covering Pinkie's failure to deal with the situation as a "grown up". You did even better in this chapter with her characterization in her dealing with the guard as herself, rather than as simply a voice for Twilight. It's good to see Pinkie not as somepony immature or just dumb, but somepony who refuses to be held down by the bad things in life despite her understanding of them.
The closing was fun, too. Poor Zecora! I'm sure, though, that it will all get sorted out in the end. ;)
@Macon Mixx
ReplyDeleteWhat I said also wasn't 'personally' addressed to you, but rather was a 'general statement' relative to what you had said.
---
I would also agree on what you said about Braveheart.
We can relatively easily see how Philomina would create such a reaction, considering its importance (relatively speaking, considering what little we see of it, in the series) to Celestia, and the symbol a Phoenix usually represent in mythology.
But, yeah... it seems like there's a 'step' missing between the ''military ass'' Braveheart we know from earlier chapter, and the suddenly reasonable and magnanimous Braveheart of this chapter.
@Nova25
ReplyDeleteIn regards to "Mother Thracia", I was having a bit of fun. As the Thracian Mares are infamous for devouring humans and wreaking havoc, I loved the irony of using it to allude to Mother Theresa of Calcutta.
Also thank you for a proper French translation.
@Nova25
ReplyDeleteGrey Prophet, the writer. We end up talking like every chapter.
The last one, kinda got destrubing, basicly Grey thinks its ok to do anything in the name of national security, reguardless of the real reason. Even used Japanese internment as an explane.
For the reason there was 100,000 japanese locked in camped during the war.
Compare the 10,000 Germans in camps, and the 20,000 German Americans who openly supported the Nazi Party DURING the war
...
ReplyDelete...
Are we supposed to be rooting for Braveheart or Luna...?
^
ReplyDeleteWho knows and really who cares. The writer has said this was suppost to be for Celestia but no one can hear him form all the luagher about that ideal.
I mean what the fuck is this some kinda of Bizzardo Braveheart. His character has done a 180 in less than a second. And again, Big Mac was in the right, those guards might have names but they treaten to burn his home to the ground while Mac's family which has two member who would most likely die form the smoke (Granny and Bloom) they attacked unarmed civilains who didn't know what's going on. This isn't war those are the people the guard are suppost to protect.
Also dispite claims the writer has made, over and over this really is just another "Celestia = bad, Luna = good" story, its kinda sad to see a story that catch was about how Luna wasn't an innocent victim and Celestia not being a tyrant become just that.
Moring Star is now some big hero rather than a power hunger bitch,
Looking forward to the next two chapters for this story!
ReplyDelete@d715
ReplyDelete>Who knows and really who cares
-Huhhhhh... Us, maybe ?
>The writer has said
-While we can respect what the author says (would be better if HE was actually the one saying things, instead of someone saying that's what the author ''said''... you understand?) about his own things... it's still the 'readers' that are 'reading', after all.
And so, what the author intended/thought may not be what the readers will perceive.
Again, this is just a general statement.
---
Also... I'm not sure to really understand what you tried to say or meant with your previous comment ?
@Nova_25
ReplyDeleteSorry, sometimes I ramble/type without thinking clearly.
I was tring to say it feels like the writer seems to be one of those "its ok to give up freedom for safity" types even wend the actions taken are clearly not moveivated by the need to protect the nation but rather just blind hate.
Take Braveheart now his character is so differnet you would think he's really some twin form an aliternet universe, for no reason other than "Braveheart and his methods are right, Applejack is wrong, and should be grateful that they tried to burn down her farm and nearly killed her brother and family"
Big mac was defending his farm and love ones for what ammoints to Stormtroopers and thugs there is no grey and grey.
Also my other post, well this takes place one year after the plot, which means its the middle of the summer, yet for some reason the Everfree forest is having a snow storm. There is no reason for this. Unless of course Windigos but it doesn't seem the cast as one of the characters seems to meantion it.
CH.12 :
ReplyDelete>the five friends, in their enthusiasm, tried piling out of the hut at once
-Odd... I thought they were ‘all’ far from the hut, when Zecora came back to her home, last chapter ?
Continuity ?
>following the trail of a rouge goddess
>Rouge goddesses, cursed forests
-‘’rogue’’ (small error)
(Urban dict. : Rogue. Commonly misspelled "rouge".)
>with a bunch of vulnerable kids to protect.
-Huh... he forgot about the Elements right ? Also, it wasn’t written in his files that they outran an hydra, ‘’tamed’’ a manticore, submitted a dragon AND a cockatrice, I suppose ? (and I’m not even mentioning their individual abilities)
>Thriving in the sun's absence and bringing little but misery and death
-And the whole ecosystem thing, and the animals living at night or needing the cold climate, and...
He really just see the bad side of everything, isn’t he ?
>but...you've got the whole flippin world on a platter.
-*cough* A country... or ‘nation’, if you prefer the term.
>Celestia had brought him in out of the darkness and cold to spare him from a sinful life.
-So...? He hates/dislikes Luna, and mostly hates the *night* ; Because, when he was young he almost died from *COLD* during a *SNOW STORM* ?
His brain works in odd ways...
>"Thank you Storm..." he whispered, "...my little Celestia."
-This sounds a bit more ‘’creepy’’ than it should be.
>"Yes, captain, what help could you possibly want from a 'bitch'?"
-Why in the 9 hells is she saying that ? This is NOT Rarity. She’s not vulgar like that.
Also, to be sure, I quickly scanned the previous parts... Found ONE(1) *spoken* use of this word, back in CH.8... when he was speaking to BLUEBLOOD ! And, ONE(1), waaaaaaay back in CH.6...
With the ‘’alliance’’ concluded, AND the large amount of time that passed and stuff that happened, AND considering Rarity’s character... No way she would just go and say that, like some sort of pitiful vengeance.
>Listen here you tree-bucker, those soldiers your Big Mac sent to the ward, they had names too! Here, let me list 'em off to ya!
-(siiiiiigh)... Read the dictionary while you’re at it ?
>Getting closer to Applejack, the captain whispered in her ear.
>Tell me the truth Apple, tell me that you won't be happy until you see my head on a pike."
-From ‘ass-Braveheart’, to ‘strangely good-Braveheart’, and back to ‘ass-Braveheart’... He suffers from split-personality or something ?
>Ajax Mikhael had returned with his unquenchable thirst for vengeance.
-Huh... might be remembering this wrong, but... Wasn’t he thrown into a deep hole/chasm-thingy, and with a sleep spell, last time ?
... The small part, with Luna ‘’falling’’ in a gorge... ?for a second?... Is it just me or does it feel like a bit pointless ? ...
-----
Well, it wasn’t a bad chapter... all things considered.
The ‘backstory’ part was somewhat interesting, though we don’t really get much information that we didn’t already know. He really likes Celestia... ‘because she was like a mother for him’. He hates Luna/dislikes her nights... ‘because...huh...he almost died from cold in a blizzard, and it was night ?’, that’s not entirely clear.
Also... Rarity very suddenly becoming oddly vindictive for a moment ?
I dunno if anyone else has submitted a song, but I thought I'd give it a go. I've no idea what you want in a pinkie song for your OC so I made a fairly quick general "Welcome to Ponyville!" song. Please email or post more details so I can get it closer, if possible.
ReplyDeleteMod: Very jazzy. In fact, starts with a small solo from Pinkie on the sax. Because.
Welcome! Hi there! Nice to see
The face of a brand new pony!
You're new to town so come on down
Let your friend Pinkie show you 'round
Stop by my shop and get a treat
Our sweets are fresh and can't be beat
And if you think you're hankerin for something we ain't bakin' then
I'll go out of my way to make sure you can get your cravin's in
How 'bout some duds? You're BOUND to see
Something amazing with Rarity
She'll deck you out in style and class
You'll catch all eyes when you walk past
Or maybe you're more down to earth
Pastures and fields are more your turf
Let's go to Sweet Apple Acers soon
With Applejack, Big Mac, Granny and Apple Bloom!
Twilight's got plenty here to read
And Rainbowdash can show you speed
Our Fluttershy's the cutest yet
You'll love it here, it's one sure bet
I've lived here nearly my whole life
Here love and happiness are rife
So if you would feel free to stay
We'll party all the night and day
Wo Wo Wo Wo Wo Wo Wo Wo! (first four descending scale, second four ascending)
Welcome, welcome, stay a while!
I guarantee you'll smile, smile, smile!
Here every day's a surefire blast
You'll get on up to speed real fast
So everypony, come see me
Here we're one big family
I swear you'll never get your fill
Of sweet, amazing, lovely, blazing Ponyville!
Yeah!
I really want to like this more than I do. I really do, it's got so much potential, but at the current point in time, it's gone rather loony. I can't relate to the canon characters as anything like the characters they're supposed to be in the show. The outright brutality and callousness shown by some ponies is incredibly jarring, especially in a story not tagged grimdark, and ESPECIALLY since we're supposed to start sympathising with them later in the story. Sorry, but I don't feel prepared to ever start treating Captain "have you ripped limb from limb right in front of your family just before they lose their heads to ol' lady guillotine!" Braveheart as anything other than a monstrous, soulless psychopath.
ReplyDeleteI've never really been a fan of ponies openly worshiping the Princesses as deities, nor of the Princesses thinking of themselves as such. The idea of Ajax - a character whose purpose in the story I am entirely unsure of to begin with - being "Vicar of Celestia" just jarred me straight out of the story.
This story is 3/5 in my eyes, but it's 6-star material, and I really want it to live up to that. It just needs a lot of work.
Welp.
ReplyDeleteThere goes any potential sympathy for anyone in this story.
It has been a while... but, I should still remember most things, normally.
ReplyDelete-----
CH.13 :
>its rape and final destruction inevitable.
-Other than the widely common sense of ‘that’ word (rape, noun or verb)... I only found this : *archaic : to seize and take away by force.
Soooo... unless, or even if it’s the intended meaning here... It might be a good idea to select another word, no ?
>"Warriors of Celestia!" Ajax shouted, "Now is the hour of our vengeance!
-Wait... now he’s in Canterlot, miles away from the Everfree Forest where Luna is currently ?
>Ajax charged into the griffon ranks like a spiral of blood and fire.
-Wait, what ? The dragon (who was crazy on killing Luna and/or the night guards too, in previous chapter) is now in Canterlot AND fighting an invading army of griffins ?
...since when or why does the Griffin Nation attacking the ponies (other than ‘’It’s night since 2-3 days ? Let’s invade Equestria !’’) ?
>Like the rest of princess' subjects, Ajax found it difficult to look at the Celestia directly.
-... ... ... sigh -_- ... Let me guess ? It’s all just a ‘’flashback’’ section ?
I quite dislike those ‘unannounced flashbacks, ‘’innocently’’ put at the beginning of a chapter, that just end up being unnecessarily confusing’.
... Celestia, in the past (and probably still is somewhat), from what we see here was a real manipulative ass ? ...
>"It was no magic." the goddess muttered "Magic is not a weapon..."
-What a dumb thing to say ? The entirety of the adventure/RPG universe disagree strongly to Celestia’s statement.
>"A forbidden type of alchemy.
-...is even ‘Science’ forbidden with her or something ?
(Celestia is worth 10 Nightmare Moon, right now)
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>"I've heard that some dragons can't see you if you don't move. They're not a very perceptive lot."
-...wow ? I’m not a dragon, but I still feel a bit insulted by her dire lack of knowledge about dragons ? Just say that to a ‘Venerable Wyrm’, see if he finds it funny.
>Oh, and he has a really, really bigthingfor Princess Celestia.
-3 words stuck together.
>Ajax glared at Rarity for a moment, bur answered
-‘’but’’ (small error)
... So far, the interventions of the Elements (Pinky Pie, Rarity, and AJ talking) is relatively interesting ...
>hey, wait, it's now safe!"
>Ignoring Lightning Strike completely, Pinkie Pie ran off in the direction of the crash.
-From what I get here, it was supposed to be ‘not’ instead of ‘now’, isn’t it ? (small error ?)
>"Cut that bullshit," Braveheart said, looking past her shoulder, "I'm as good as dead, ain't that right sweetheart?"
-Ok. You heard him. He’s dead... so, let’s now skip about a full page of him agonizing for what seems HOURS!
(Not that it’s a ‘’bad’’ scene, but it’s stretched quite a bit...)
>Princess Celestia, goddess of the sun and sovereign of Equestria, stood before Luna entirely divested of her divine power.
-Huhhh... sooo..? Very shortly after Luna left Canterlot, she ‘’somehow in some way(s) because of something’’ lost her powers, like Luna, but without the action of the Elements ?
...I literally have no real theory on this. It’s part of her plan to cruelly troll Luna ? ‘Mom and/or Dad’ came and spanked her for so atrociously abusing her powers ?
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Overall, it was interesting... but, the ‘flashback’ at the beginning should have been ‘’announced’’ a bit more (to prevent risking confusion). Also, for a super-magic goddess, Celestia has a weird idea about magic (and also science) ?
@Sun Ray
ReplyDeleteAnd, you sir, utterly fail at basic diplomacy and politeness, with such a first sentence.
Also, the very basis of your comment does NOT have to be, since... you obviously didn't read the whole comment, because :
>-... ... ... sigh -_- ... Let me guess ? It’s all just a ‘’flashback’’ section ?
>I quite dislike those ‘unannounced flashbacks, ‘’innocently’’ put at the beginning of a chapter, that just end up being unnecessarily confusing’.
Glorious!
ReplyDeleteThe conclusion hath arrived!
I shall read this...
...
Dumb being too busy.
After I am done working... );
Feels a little... incomplete? Did she confess? How will people will react to Luna now? What about the dead? What about the royal families and Blueblood?
ReplyDeleteIt's not like Luna and Celestia can walk in and say "everything is fine, sorry for the massacre lol". Will the people accept them? Or will only more lies be told?
@Natzo
ReplyDeleteThis.
The whole story felt like it went WAY off track halfway through, and it took sheer force of will to stay interested. And this is the payoff? It's just...so...weak.
It almost feels like you just gave up. But at least you didn't turn the whole story into a snuff film. I'm looking at you, The Sun Is Tired.
So Celestia vanished, threw the country into chaos, let the zealous military instill martial law, caused riots which resulted in untold deaths...
ReplyDelete...just so she could teach Luna a lesson.
...
You know, there's a point where realpolitik becomes excessively impractical.
I agree with those. I'm glad that the payoff is there. But it just sorta...
ReplyDeleteWell, it happened because it needed to happen for the story to end, Twilight infodump and everything, rather than because it naturally flowed to a logical conclusion. And it leaves so many questions unanswered and caused so much strife and damage to everyone involved (including the Elements, who now have to deal with their own sins which is exactly what Celly didn't want) that it all seems... anti-climactic.
Still... This is a landmark moment, for this to end after over a year. It's been a hell of a ride, and all told I'm glad I was there for it.
@pg13fresno
ReplyDeleteNo... please, by the Hell Gods... don't tell me that what this Natzo said is what actually happens ?
... ... ...Almost since the beginning that I was hoping this wouldn't *EXACTLY* led to such a ''shitty''(pardon the word) end...
I hope this isn't as bad as this sounds like... I really hope.
@pg13fresno
ReplyDeleteI think the problem with this story was that the author was trying to please everyone without really planning ahead and trying to fit everything into canon. It's noticeable with Braveheart who was totally unlikeable but was still suppose to be sympathetic.
The characters do 180s all the time. And there are so many side stories with no resolution that it feels weak. Feels like the original ending of Mass Effect 3.
They all hug in the end, but still screw everyone else in their tantrums and face no repercussions other than a few hurt feelings.
CH.14 :
ReplyDelete>Celestia asked bitterly, "Forgive me for what I did today, I only sought to follow your example..."
>Never what, little sister? Never disregarded your duty? Never left me to deal with the aftermath of your carelessness? Never betrayed my trust and confidence to our enemies?
-What crap is she spewing now ?
From what little I remember of this story, Luna tried to institute a democracy, while Celestia was ABSOLUTELY ADAMANT at accepting this and relinquishing her hold on the ponies... then proceeded to *FORCE* her to stop through the use of the Elements and killing her generals/friends once she was banished...
All those things worsened and/or actually happened because she acted like a dictator, and an ass to Luna ?
Also, while Celestia ''left her duties'', nothing could have stopped her from telling, AT LEAST, her General to not kill Luna...
...let's just say that I'm not (absolutely not) on Celestia's side, in this story, to say the least. Not that I think that it's actually possible to be on her side, with what we were told in 'this' story.
>"Are you trying to tell me that you, the princess who banished me to secure her throne and rule unchecked for one thousand years, is just sitting on her rump doing nothing?"
>"...Yes." >I needed the strength to cast off my titles, my responsibilities, and...and my power.
-Again... almost the WHOLE nation of Equestria(its military, at least) is kinda trying to KILL Luna ! ''Casting off X,etc...'' is one thing, not telling your General to not go after Luna, BEFORE going into hiding, is one heck of another thing...
>but you, you would be flying recklessly from place to place with no final destination in mind.
-She had to ''fly'' recklessly, yeah, because the military were after her, mostly to kill her... -_-
But, her ''destinations'' were rather precise and determined, trying to solve the mystery and restore her ''immortality'', by finding the Bearers... while trying to not be sentenced like a 'witch', because of Celestia...
>"But...but princess." Twilight responded, "How could you really test yourself if you made yourself powerless?"
-...to... test herself ? Test her resolve ? She really IS ''evil(-like)'' and moronic in 'THIS' dimension ?
>It's because I willed it-I freed the seasons from their shackles."
-The heck ? The Princesses are responsible for the MOON and SUN ! Exclusively.
The seasons' mechanism, in Equestria and probably the rest of the world, was never ''controlled/induced'' by them... it's within what allow pegasi to move clouds and etc, and make magic possible on this world. Everfree Forest is the only *know* anomaly.
>What you need to do is not concentrate power, you need to disperse it.
>Celestia answered, "You know that their innocence will be forever lost if that were to happen. There would be no chance for your ideal society to thrive."
-You mean... to equally give their 'magic power' to ''everyone'', so that ''everyone'' will equally be more 'magical' and able to do/deal with magic stuff ? Kinda like, controlling the weather, using magic, being strong and good at growing stuff, and etc, but just more by themselves ?
You mean... kinda like is it RIGHT NOW !? Just 'version 2.0' instead of '1.0' ?
>No offense, but I feel like you could've done this a whole lot safer if you told somepony you'd be gone for the day!"
>"I told you, I wasn't thinking-"
-Yeeeeeah... In 'this' story, Celestia has been abnormally dumb, to say the least..?
@Nova25
ReplyDelete>"Assemble the Elements of Harmony and give my sister back her divine power."
-Even if this seems ''good'', positive... why do I find myself NOT trusting this 'somewhat good turn of event' for a second ?
>He does not deserve to buried in Everfree
-''to be buried'' (small error)
>"A new day is born." >"Let it last forever!"
-That's... that's actually how it ends ? I seriously don't even know if I can 'truly' say that it ended ''good''(relatively speaking) or (potentially)''bad'' for them... for their future ?
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...I must agree with Natzo and pg13fresno.
Also, while it wasn't AS bad as I thought it would be, the ending I mean... it did confirmed a few of my ''fears'' on how it would all end...
There are just... so many things and ideas, good/bad/terrible/interesting, that mix together ? I don't know, if I would be able to put them all into a proper ''perspective''... about how I see them, feel about them ?
Am I still disappointed by how the ending played, even thought I was ''somewhat'' expecting this to happen since the first few chapters ? Yes...
Was I interested by how the story had played until now, and partially by the ending, even though it had 'some ups and a few heavy downs' ? I would suppose Yes.
How much did things, ultimately, changed/will change for Equestria and for the rest of the world ? Will Luna and Celestia still remain in this world, but just not in a position of power over mortals ?
We might never know... even if there's an ''epilogue''.
Hey remember 'half the day is night' how celestia put luna in charge to show eveyone that she wasn't evil while people have real reasons to hate her (luna layed off a lot of her staff)
ReplyDeleteI wish i was reading that that had logic and the cast were smart
anyway the problem was through writer
a didn't have a real guild line and if he did he sure did not follow it
b doesn't understand culture and how it works. He knows onlythe facts form textbooks but not the mindset for why it happens. He keeps thinking the everfree is the correct way their world works because that how ours works. But this isn't our world. and even if it did its hasn't for well over 2000 years at least by that logic the everfree is the freaky weird one.