I contemplated posting this for a good 2 hours or so. I always like to avoid drama, but he makes some really good points.
An Open Letter to the Brony Community
Bring back the love!
(Feel free to discuss it in the comments, but please don't send me your versions :3)
769 kommentaari:
I applaud this man for having the balls to say what alot of us are thinking.
VastaKustutaI read this letter earlier today, and I have to say that this brony is spot-on.
VastaKustutaI think that if any fandom can resist falling to the hypocritical dark-side that so many fandoms have fallen to, it's this one.
/facepalm
VastaKustutaI liked it, and the message was good. Besides Hasbro possibly trolling us, the biggest threat to the community is likely it's own members.
VastaKustutaJust by nature, there will always likely be some aspect of hate; this is an empire built on the internet. Hopefully we can all grow a lil' steer ourselves away from the fandom's rough edges.
I -would- say though, it's not always right to accept everything. Even in this case, a situation of "Intolerance will not be tolerated". If haters MUST hate, hopefully they can save it for what truly deserves it.
@Anonymous
VastaKustutaThis.
*slow claps*
VastaKustutaOh good, the slow clap function made it into this thing.
But really I do agree. Nip the hate in the bud. Well except the furry hate, that's a full grown plant cause it's always been there.
I just skimmed it, but it seems like a nice read. A bit "dramatic", yeah. Some common sense, all applicable to Internet and communication in general.
VastaKustutaA lot of petty and ridiculous problems that every community experiences that can easily be solved just by being clear-headed... Which we humans often have trouble with.
Oh and, yes, there are trolls in real life too: you think people watch O'Reilly because he's a political genius?.. That's right. "Serious business" is as much of an excuse IRL as it is here.
It's not a game. You're talking to real people. But, just like in real life, you can always just walk away.
---
Here, let me give you a skinny on etiquette in general:
-Don't be mean.
-"He started it" isn't a valid excuse.
Furries are, and always will be in my opinion, the destroyers of fandoms like this. I stand firm with my points I made in the thread on ponychan.
VastaKustutaBravo for writing this open letter. Thanks very much.
VastaKustutaHave lots of non-ironic love and tolerance.
"Except the furry hate, that's a full grown plant cause it's always been there."
VastaKustutaEven better, then.
Time to do some WEEDING.
I salute you good sir. If I didn't live across the country from you, I would go to your house and shake your hand.
VastaKustutaFunny, I was just about to write pretty much this exact same thing. Overdramatic, maybe, but no less necessary.
VastaKustutaSeriously bronies, Love and tolerance, lets get back on track here.
Welp, I know someone that has two thumbs and has more balls than I do: the author of the letter.
VastaKustuta21 year-old shipper here. There's nothing wrong with welcoming new bronies, no matter where they come from. If there's something about certain individuals in the herd you don't like, you're not forced to talk to them! Just nod your head and move on...
That said, welcome all, old and new.
Very well said. Haters gonna hate, as 'twere, it's the reaction to that hate that counts. Thanks for posting it Blog Brony.
VastaKustutaI remember when this used to be a /co/-only fandom which policed itself and kept the weirdos out.
VastaKustutaGod I miss that. :\
If I met a brony on the street, and he was dressed up in a full body anthropomorphic wolf costume, I'd give that dude a brofist. I've never understood furry culture and I probably never will, but a guy or gal that likes MLP is a friend of mine. True story.
VastaKustutaLove and tolerance ftw.
@Fon ShaolinAs an avid fan of the Clop Fic genre, the propagation of Gory GrimDark fics used for humorous, non-painful purposes, and a Furry, I have to agree with this, but only because my future works are going to destroy the fandom.
VastaKustutaagreed in every way
VastaKustutathe magic of friendship is hard to sustain, though. we are our own enemies
"Here was a fan of a show that teaches us about love and acceptance"
VastaKustutaSee, this shit is what gets my blood boiling.
You're not gonna like what I say next, and frankly, I don't care.
If it takes a show designed for pre-teenager girls to teach an adult male (or several hundred, it seems) a code of ethics, then those people have issues. With their upbringing, with their self-identity, something. I'm not saying I'm perfect, but when I watch the show I'm not like "Man, this is so fucking deep." No, I probably blush a bit and/or fast-forward through it (the 'moral' bits) because it's shit I know already, and more than any other time I feel my displaced fandom of the show during those "DEAR PRINCESS CELESTIA" moments.
More than that, I feel embarrassed for the hundreds of 'bronies' out there. I do, in fact, find you guys like the furry fandom (I know, the letter this post addresses talks about that), but let me put that into context: I'm FINE with furries. Whatever they want to enjoy, it's their mind. My issues lies with the people who make a LIFESTYLE out of it, and that applies to bronies who fit that description. If you don't understand what I mean, I'm referring to those people who have started trying to teach their RL friends about friendship (NOT about the show, mind you, but trying to be moral bastions because of it) or are embracing this show like a fucking religion.
And you WONDER why you garner so much hatred from the non-brony community?
I'm a fan of the show, mind you. I enjoy the humor of it. But... that's all. I am at a point in my adulthood where I feel that I don't need a cartoon to tell me how to treat my friends or teach me not to lie. And I feel a bit embarrassed for those of you who DO feel that way, because that says something about who you are as a person.
I know that you're all just gonna call me a dick and a parasprite and all that shit, but think about it. I'm not saying all this to be mean-spirited or anything, I'm saying it because all this 'ponies are legion' bullshit is getting on my nerves. Notice that? Yes, I did just liken you to "Anonymous" -- and it's a similar psychological phenomenon.
It's a bit long but it clearly has a point.
VastaKustutaI was also very alarmed when I read the Filly/Yari discussion because this was somehow very familiar.
We don't want to have /b/'s oldfag/newfag stuff or any of the infamous shipping wars or furry drama, yet it looks like we are getting everything at once.
Just accept that different people focus on different aspects of the show and do with it what they want. Don't try to pretend there is only one possible fanon.
There will be shipping, there will be rule34, there will be "OC, DO NOT COPY" and there will be people not respecting the creators at all.
Same as for trolls: Ignore what you don't like, but don't hate on it.
I'm with ya, man. My name's Jamie Clarke, age 23, I live on the Gold Coast, Australia, and I enjoy shipping.
VastaKustutaI'm not personally a fan of furry stuff or clopfics, but I've no problem with those who are. I'd post my email here in solidarity and such, but I'm more concerned about unrelated phishing than trolls.
I kinda have an irrational fear of furries, not gonna lie about it. But this guy has balls, I'll give him that much.
VastaKustutaStill, hate exist in every fandom, and it's usually squabbling among fans themselves. But in the case of MLP, I'd much rather hangout in a separate non-furry community dedicated to MLP just because I think I would be more comfortable there.
Not to mention I'm not a fan of femslash. I'm sorry but my barn door just doesn't swing that way.
@ruff1298
VastaKustutaClop fics aren't even the problem. It's not the porn that's a bad thing (different folks different strokes), but it's the DRAMA furries bring to any fandom and the general creepyness.
Seeing a clopfic about a futa Luna doing her sister isn't nearly as unsettling as reading a post about a 20-something guy in a fursuit screwing his rainbow dash body pillow. And trust me, if we don't -discourage- these people from the community that's where it will end up. We'll have little Chris-chans running around on ponychan all day long and original characters that take up the majority of people's time.
Cry moar.
VastaKustutaIm just kidding, but seriously people take this way too seriously... Just watch the show and keep your opinions to yourself!
I think "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all" is more than applicable to this situation, if you can even call it that.
Whiners gonna whine and furries still gonna fur. Who cares, it's ponies.
+50 respect there, totally true Ben, I agree with you.
VastaKustutaThis isn't going to change anything. This isn't going to make trolls go "oh. Well. Gosh golly, I'm so sorry. Would you like to share a coffee?"
VastaKustutaIt isn't going to make the furries stop being inconsiderate.
It isn't going to make the furry haters stop hating on the furries.
It doesn't change a thing.
This is a vent. It isn't inspirational, it isn't good for the community. It isn't even meaningful.
I have sympathy for the writer - things happen then I dont like either. Actually, people like the author of this are the ones taking over and doing things I dont like. I don't ship ponies, I dont fap to them. I'm not a furry.
The difference is that I accept that other people like what I dont like and dont like the things I like, without writing a huge venting letter that is essentially lubing up your own ass and bending over for the trolls. I'm sure he feels exhilarated for having written it. Heart poundingly full of adrenaline for ~*being the brave one and standing up to the bullies*~. Yay people are applauding the things I said and the way I feel yaaaay.
Except, I would feel less annoyed if only author hadn't bitched about feeding the parasprites.
What is this, if not massive fuel. Way to go. Good job adding to that drama.
@angrytigerp
VastaKustutaSeconded so much it hurts. Seeing people posting "love and friendship, just like the poniez!11" all day long is starting to get on my nerves.
It's a fandom: watch it, like it, discuss it, and create for it - don't try and turn it into a religion.
@Fon ShaolinWell, it is the internet. It's the freeist of free mediums where pretty much anything can happen.
VastaKustutaIf it'll make things better, I propose we post big-ass signs on the front pages reminding everyone that:
-These are human beings.
-Human beings are generally nice to each other.
-Anything you post on the internet can and WILL be used against you.
It'd be so awesome if they did that.
I'm not going to hate on people for liking what they like. As long as they don't show anything explicit there's no harm no foul.
VastaKustutaThe thing is, when some people take there love of furry stuff too far and it becomes like some kind of ideology, that's when things fall apart for me. Some furries just seem fairly misanthropic. I mean, ponies are cool, but does that mean humans suck?
While I think the basic points are good and he is right that people can be assholes I think you mostly have to look at it like everything else on the internet. Trolls are gonna troll. You just have to ignore it.
VastaKustutaEvery fandom has its trolls. I've never seen a fandom die because it got trolled to death.
I have just gained so much respect for this man. Brony love, saving the world. Rock on. B)
VastaKustutaThank you angrytigerp.
VastaKustutaCalm down people.
@angrytigerp
VastaKustutaI respect you and your point, because it's a pretty valid one; I'm not the brony who needs these lessons, either, but I'm glad that a worthwhile show is available to children to at least attempt to bring the message to the children that need to learn it. Through the morals of the show, I usually end up nodding my head, thinking to myself, 'You know, I hope my hypothetical kid learns that lesson to heart sooner than later in life.'
You like the show for your reasons, I like the show for mine.
@angrytigerp
VastaKustutaIt wasn't about learning them from the show as much as respecting the source material.
Wow, the comments here are... Interesting.
VastaKustuta'Love and tolerate everyone! ... Except those guys, we hate those guys, they ALL ruin everything. ALL OF THEM.'
That's a little silly, ponies, and I'm pretty sure it's not the message that the posting is trying to get across.
I applaud this letter, it's a bold move and it sends a good message. Personally I've been a little afraid that this fandom would fall into the nitch category, or go the way that Sonic has and having huge hate between fans who like different things (And of course the constant argument over furries. People like different things, if you don't like something that someone else likes you don't have to. Just get over it already)
VastaKustutaAs I started getting my fan fictions posted on this blog I saw some ponies encouraging me, some ponies discouraging me, and some ponies just not caring. I've treated them all the same, with love and tolerance. I can't expect everypony to agree with my writing, or to see the same things that I envision for it. I don't care if someone tries to flame me, I simply laugh and make them disappear. Wise words from our very own Pinkie Pie.
Also, what's with the whole idea of furries taking down a fandom? The people who are furries are generally people who just want to show their love for a show just as much. If anything it's the people who snipe at the furries and start arguments with them that bring the fandoms down. So this is a call to all my fellow furries who read this. You start seeing anypony calling you a furfag or similarly knocking you for something you enjoy? Ignore them, don't engage. Keep posting your artwork, keep expressing your ideas, and eventually they'll find that they can't anger you and just leave.
Which brings me to my next point of my mini-rant. If you don't like something just ignore it and leave. Personally? I don't like Grimdark stories all that much. Does that mean I'm going to bitch and moan? Does that give me the right to whine? No, all it means is I have a different interest from other people and I should be respected for those interests and I should respect other people's interests. Grimdark isn't going to kill the fandom, like the letter author said it's hate that's going to kill the fandom. From my experence with fandoms it's always hate that kills fandoms and makes them nitch. I dislike going to Sci-Fi conventions. Why? I'm a Sci-Fi Writer, I read Sci-Fi why should I feel nervous about going to conventions? Because I know how critical fans are in those environments. Last convention I was ridiculed by a guy by going as an OC instead of some recognizable character. Why should I go and be a part of the Sci-Fi community when people ridicule me for attempting to fit in the only way I know how?
And that's my two bits
@Anonymous
VastaKustutaI know the point he's trying to get across and I'm saying it's the wrong one. This community, to protect itself from becoming another Star Fox or Sonic fandom, has to go back to its 4chan roots where everyone was a total bastard to the weirdos.
That's wouldn't stifle the community, either. Avatar thrived in /co/ for years and some of the best fanworks came from anons. Hell, the Avatar community in general is a good model - you don't see them acting weird and their fanbase is HUGE.
Love and friendship is good; great, even. You wouldn't, however, invite a cancer into your body because you were a nice person, would you?
@Anonymous
VastaKustutaI disagree simply because this wasn't meant for the trolls, and the people this was directed at are at least slightly more likely to give some consideration to what he had to say.
I'm starting to think that-
VastaKustutaYou know what? It's 12:50 at night; my mind is not ready for discussing touchy subjects rationally. I guess I'll just wake up to the aftermath.
Sir, you have earned my respect.
VastaKustutaKalen Tessmann here, 21 years of age, living on the west coast of Canada. I'd been starting to feel the same way, but it's kinda sobering to see someone put it into words.
Now I'm not a furry and I don't read clopfics, but you know what? I accept that others do. It's not interfering with my life, I can simply dodge the threads I don't like, and everyone stays happy that way. I see no problem with this.
Personally I like to think I was raised with a pretty strong moral code, I'm getting no new lessons from this show, but there's still something refreshingly pure about it.
I will ALWAYS welcome the newfoals. I was one once myself, obviously. I don't think I could handle being the kind of hypocrite who claims to be a fan of a show focused on friendship and kindness and then turns around and spouts hate at anyone, let alone someone who's exploring the fandom with wide-eyed wonder.
@Fon Shaolin, of course there are furries that bring massive drama to stuff. You show me ANY fandom that lacks a native element of severe drama in some regard. It just happens that it's a rather popularized portion of the furry crowd. I have friends who are furries and are some of the most drama-free people I know.
It's not fair to judge someone based on such a broad label. If an individual is introducing drama that's one thing, but as a whole I say live and let live.
I mean, Bronies are every bit as weird in the eyes of outsiders. I think we'd get equally weird looks from the average parent.
As an MLP fan I come to ask some other fans for some help!
VastaKustutaI am currently up to my neck in debt due to the poor choices I have made! I know I really messed up and I deserve this, but please! My life is on the line! If anyone one could lend me just 500 bits, I can get help for my terrible Pony addiction!
@Prince Shadari
VastaKustuta"Because I know how critical fans are in those environments. Last convention I was ridiculed by a guy by going as an OC instead of some recognizable character."
That. Right there, that's it. That's what furries do: they take fandoms and make it about them rather than the original work.
Just go to deviant art and google some beloved childhood character + Sonic and see what you get. In a year's time, you'll be able to do the same thing with + pony and get similar horrifying results.
@HotTurtel
VastaKustutaNow you're just being silly. :P
Well this is kinda heated.
VastaKustuta@Fon Shaolin As a gigantic furfag, I'll let you in on a secret: just being here gives me a strong sense of deja-vu, because this is fandom is EXACTLY like what I've ever seen of furry one, back when it was starting up. Down to minute details.
Kind, creative, prolific, eager, social, occasionally mean and stupid... You name it.
If you worry about drama specifically, however, first I'd suggest is stop stirring it up. Yes, you. Stop whini- er, complaining.
@angrytigerp Join the club, we've got jackets.
@Zarkanorf
VastaKustutaTHIS, so damn much...
@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutaSo as long as we keep the fandom about the original work and not some glorified way to stroke our own egos, we're cool?
@Fire.Esper
VastaKustutaUgh, where's the industrial-strength napalm when you need it?
A good brony and someone I'm proud to be in the herd with. Don't agree with everything he said, but that's the great thing we don't have to! Good on yah!
VastaKustuta@Zarkanorf
VastaKustutaIf furries could do that, sure. But, just look in the links section of this very blog and you'll find an original character wiki that, I believe, is into the HUNDREDS of fursonas. Go look at /oat/ on ponychan and you'll see massive rp threads the likes of which even /vp/ would be ashamed of.
I'll give it a few months to see how it all plays out, but I'm not holding my breath.
Adam Hastings, San Jose, California.
VastaKustutaFurry. Bronie.
In total agreement with Ben Sims.
furries will be the end of the FiM fandom.
VastaKustutajust you wait.
I like ponies just fine, and I have no problem with others who like FiM. just keep that furry/anthro/otherkin shit out of it.
at the end of the day, it's a cute, entertaining cartoon show. that's it. frankly, I think some of the shipping goes a little too far.
@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutaI think it's more than furries that are contributing to OC ponies, Fon, but okay, I think I realize what you're getting at. Phew! Puts my mind at ease.
See you all in the morning for real, then; easier to digest these kinds of debates when you sleep on it.
I am no fan of clopfics or furry, but I have to say, that I have nothing against it. When I dont wanna watch it, I dont watch it. Thats it.
VastaKustutaI salute to this brony for his open letter. Very brave and with the soul of the elements of harmony. Just dont hate. Thats what makes us different from other fanscenes.
You know what? This guy has balls. Shaolin, just because we know what the ethics were, doesn't mean a show can't remind us. Your what's bad in the community. You cause the hate.
VastaKustutaI'm with this guy. I'm Eric Kimbrell, I live in Cincinnati Ohio, an avid fan of ponies, sports, and video games. I enjoy clop fics, and I feel like Ponies have reminded me of a small part of me I thought I lost, the loving forgiving side of me. Shaolin I forgive your comments. No more hate. Peace and love bronies.
Ugh, what drivel. I can like ponies without being buddy-buddies with people that actually have a fetish and masturbate to the characters in the show. I find that sickening and want nothing to do with people so dissociated from life like that.
VastaKustutaAnd seriously? Getting lessons from this show? I watch it because it's cute and colorful, not because of it's deep insight into life. Where even is there any shit about 'loving and tolerating all' in the show itself? Nowhere, because it's not fucking in the show. Gilda got told to fuck off for being a bitch for example. That's not loving and tolerating her unconditionally like this guy wants people to do to every fucker that decides they like ponies too.
Whatever, I'm all for being welcoming to any and all that want in (not that there's anything stopping them even if I wasn't), but I'm gonna tell people to fuck off if they're gonna act like a retard.
Hate needs to stop guys
VastaKustutaBoy, I can see why Sethisto was so concerned about opening up this can of worms. It's already spawning a battle between who can rightfully be part of a community.
VastaKustutaHow about we just let people who like things like them? Seems easier than policing who is really worthy to be a fan of something.
Thank you.
VastaKustutaFor some time now, I have been pleading with everypony on every channel to stop the hating whenever it came up.
If we as a community are going to survive, we have to be close knit and strong people, friends if you will.
This cannot come to pass with all the hate out there. I have, and will continue to take these lessons to heart, the lessons that My Little Pony has taught me:
Treat all people equally, new or old, pony or zebra.
always have trust in you friends, but don't be afraid to tell them when they need to be a little less mean.
Respect is the greatest gift we can give each other, but one must earn it.
And finally, friendship is magic.
I think tactfulness is something forgotten on this here internet.
VastaKustuta*shrugs* I guess I don't really get around to see this hatred in the community.
VastaKustutaThe only thing which comes to mind is a comic regarding an OC and Rainbow Dash, the OC is shouting at the reader how RBD is not a lesbian. It was nothing more than personal homophobic hatred, as with many of the comments agreed.
Other than that, I love the community whatever the content. I think I've sampled everything from Grimdark, shipping, Clopping, and the NSFW.
If you don't like something just ignore it.. Simples!
AppleCider is right. Why should anypony decide who should be let in? The community doesn't belong to /co/ or /b/ or ponychan or Deviantart. It doesn't belong to newfags or oldfags (just using /b/ language) It belongs to the ones who want to be in it.
VastaKustutacan we all just get along... jeez
VastaKustutaFor the people saying "just ignore what you don't like", I have this to say: eventually it will be EVERYTHING you don't like. It will all be OC ponies and anthro drama, sprawling rp sites that bury any discussion about the actual show or founding characters.
VastaKustutaFiM will become a vehicle for fursonas the likes of which we haven't seen since Sonic and SatAM. That's what they do to a fandom that has easily exploitable animal characters.
Yay for Love and Tolerance!!!!!!!!
VastaKustutafon shaolin, we can't hear you with your head so far up your ass
VastaKustutaanon 1 fon 0
Furries who make their furriness an ideology ruin fandoms.
VastaKustutaNow, let's say you're a furry and someone calls you a furfriend, except put the other word in there and not friend. That guy is a jerk.
Now let's say you are a furry and some dude says I don't like furry stuff. See, that guy isn't a jerk. But it seems like furries often feel threatened by such statements that aren't insults. People who are ideological furries have their furriness as part of their self identity, and they percieve any negative comments about furriness as being a personal attack. But it's not. Or at least it isn't necessarily.
See, if you are a furry and you like MLP, fine. Welcome. But this is not, and should not be, a furry fandom. People like this show for very many reasons, and if they don't happen to share the way you like it and they don't actively insult you then there shouldn't be a problem. People who push their beliefs on others should perhaps learn some tolerance.
@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutaI have an OC. you mad?
you shouldn't be, in fact you should be happy you like something with this much support behind it. It seems odd that furries are being targeted as the problem in a fanbase of a show about Anthro animals.
people make their OCs so they can escape their boring lives for a more vibrant one. let us at least have our imagination.
@Anonymous
VastaKustutaYou're...giving yourself points for your own comment? What? :/
@AppleCider
VastaKustutaAs one of the potentially-inflammatory commenters thus far, something tells me this addresses me. Now, nowhere did I say I feel people don't have a right to be in the community. My issue lies with what the definition of 'the community' is, and what it entails. I question some of the more... "all-encompassing" aspects some people feel it should have, where it has to pervade your life.
@FightingFire
I return to my previous point: You just now learned about equality, faith in friendship, and assertiveness? I find that hard to believe.
@Anonymous
Clearly, you haven't followed the discussion here whatsoever.
I definitely applaud you. I agree, we should all band together, and embrace each other, no matter our tastes. I mean, that's what the freaking show's about, right? Friendship is magic, so why hate others for HOW they like the show? The important part is that they like it, right?
VastaKustutagoing to be really blunt here for a moment but can anyone point out in the show where this "equality for everyone" came from?
VastaKustutayes, firendship and stuff. in other words, love and tolerate your friends. not everyone. heck the poneis drove out the parasprites by the thousands, told a griffon (read: not pony) to fuck off and theym ight as well have killed nightmare moon.
I'm not saying it's cool to hate on people for taking fandom in a certain direction, but we sure as hell don't have to just tolerate and be cool with everything people come up with.
freedom of expression before everything imo
@ItsTheWhinyGuys
VastaKustutaYou don't get it. Furries don't like the show for the show itself or the characters, they like it for the universe they can exploit for their own furry-ness.
Even if this fandom did become a religion; teaching and spreading love and tolerance, whats the problem with that? Even the people that do actually require a "show for little girls" to teach them about tolerance, whats the problem. If this fandom is teaching people to better themselves, then I say let it. Teaching someone how to love and tolerate someone isn't something that shouldn't be spread just because of how,where, or who its taught from and especially because you view it as something that everyone should know. So I say to you; trolls, haters, shippers, furies, clopers, grimdark fans, gays, and people of all race and genders to come one and come all because we will love and tolerate you.
VastaKustutamaybe we should stop arguing right now
VastaKustutaall of us are going to have different views on things and that is inevitable
why can't we just deal with that and move on
also, not every furry is into OC characters and drama
and stop being mean to each other
everyone needs to hug and make up
Why is furries always to blame? They usually keep to they're own boards and shit. I rarely come accross it, I know it exists, but it's never thrown in anyones face. I've seen some my roomate saves, but he never goes around showing it. I dont like furry stereotypes, I know to many and theyre nice and considerite. I understand some are way perverted where they must flaunt it, but isn't that true for almost any fetish?
VastaKustuta@Anonymous @Fon Shaolin Did you ever consider stop being mean to people who contribute so much art and effort to the fandom?
VastaKustutaIt's incredibly painful to see someone enjoy and praise your hard work and then tell you you're "cancer" the next. It's not just an insult, it's genuine cold-hearted evil on your part.
Here's my token: I like art. I like people helping the community. I like good-natured fans. I don't think you can be judged by a label.
Kindness and friendship are not so much "religious values" as they are important norms in the community. While many of us may be familiar with the morals illustrated in the show itself, we are human, and sometimes we can forget this stuff. When was the last time you shunned someone because they were different? Recently, I bet.
VastaKustutaAs for furries, the big issue seems to be that they are apparently corrosive to any and all fandoms. This strikes me as a really unfair generalization. Isn't it more acceptable to tolerate them to the point of drama?
Cause not all furries are bad, ya know. My brother is a furry, I think.
Autor on selle kommentaari eemaldanud.
VastaKustutaMan, i want to post some kind of profound comment back to the author of this letter and everyone, but i have no idea what i would say. I will, however, say this. Within any fandom or sampling of people there will be people you don't agree with. There will be people you don't like. There will be people you cannot possibly understand. I think we have to learn to accept that. I often find that trying to fight it just makes things worse. Partially because everyone's understanding of reality is based almost entirely on opinion, but also because diversity is healthy, and its going to happen whether you fight it or not. I'm not sure what point I'm trying to make here, but I felt obligated to post something. This is an interesting discussion.
VastaKustutaI would like to say I loved this letter. Comments have already started, where some are judging others for their likes and dislikes. If someone dislikes something that someone else made, you should see that as a contribution to the community, and shouldn't hate them for it. So what if someone likes furries or shipping or clopfics, it shouldn't matter because we are all a community of love and tolerance.
VastaKustutaHonestly, everything that this letter said could be replaced with "Dude, c'mon".
VastaKustutaHaters gonna hate. It simply doesn't need to go further than that.
@Fire.Esper
VastaKustutaPerhaps I am interpreting this the wrong way, but the people you are addressing seem to share a similar view to mine -- it is NOT about WHY they like the show, it's how they address their fandom. And, unless I miss my mark, they agree with me that, like attention-whore furries, bronies who always feel the need to add 'I'll love and tolerate the shit out of people!!!!11!" and quote the show and otherwise profess their unconditional love and desire to have sex with the show that are the problem.
If you want to fuck a goat, be my guest. Do whatever makes you happy. Do NOT fuck a goat in public and get angry because some people don't tolerate it.
@Anonymous Don't worry, it's not physically possible, even if anyone wanted to.
VastaKustuta@Fon Shaolin No, not true. Let go of your hate.
@Anonymous Think videogames and rock n' roll. Sometimes it's popular to hate things and say they're the root of all evil. If this fandom gets big enough, it'll be blamed too... In fact I've seen it already is in a few places.
Hating furries stopped being cool about five years ago, about the same time as emos. In fact it's a good way to distinguish between newfags/oldfags.
No one is forcing you to look at or read the stuff you don't like, but for a bunch of you its more a case of "I don't like it so no one else can either!" as opposed to "I don't like it but you can if you want to."
VastaKustutaSays a lot about your inflexible stereotyping personalities you know.
If this man had said this in an audience, I would be one of many people that im sure would applaud this guy for what he has said. This message brought a tear to my eyes. A truly magnificent display of words.
VastaKustutaI just want to say... To all those who find it ridiculous that people behave in such a goody-two-shoes manner due to this show, think about the things you may have learned in school.
VastaKustutaHistory, bizarre math tricks, seemingly pointless rules about English... Do you remember them all? You've likely forgotten quite a lot from your years in school because you just didn't use the information enough for it to be kept fresh in your mind.
The same, sadly, is true of morality and ethics. Much of it was lost for many people, because the coldness of the world caused them to believe it was unnecessary to remember. There were so many other ways to approach problems that didn't involve the use of these morals, that there was hardly any point in retaining the information.
Now this show comes along. A miracle in its quality, something actually enjoyable to watch. So, people watch it. And that has led to this second miracle. People are reminded of the morals that they cast aside long ago, and reincorporate it into their lives.
It sounds silly, I'm well aware of that. But regaining morality has made many, many people far happier with themselves and their lives. Why is that a bad thing, in your eyes?
if you hate something that's fine
VastaKustutait's annoying though when you think everyone else needs to know that
Said like a true Brony. I salute you Mr. Ben Sims.
VastaKustutaLet us try to rebuilt back this Bronyhood into its fullest glory. As it is, and should always be..
I'll say he was bold, but it's just what we all knew anyways. Now I would like to bring up something else...
VastaKustutaI'm a fan of MLP, it was /b/ that got me into it after seeing so many pony threads. When I first started watching the show I remember posting as an Anon and asking for some youtube links. If no one gave me links I was going to troll them, and even if they did provide links I was going to use their show to troll them because I thought the love for a little girl's show was stupid. Well...things didn't quite go that way that night. I ended up watching the first 10 episodes in one night. I couldn't figure out why I liked the show so much, but I knew why I liked the community. It was the sensible amount of love and tolerance. I hate the rule 34 shit with the ponies, and the furry porn stuff, and very rarely is their good furry artwork that isn't sexual. It's a weird culture, but whatever floats your boat (what I'm saying is that I really don't care much for it, but I also think it should never be intertwined with another community such as the bronies). That's why I liked the pony threads, it was discouraged to make rule 34 of MLP, it became the exception for the most part. The MLP community as it stands is great; you have the steady amount of OC being made, the Dawww images, the great fanfictions (I found 'Cupcakes' interesting), musical mixes, youtube poops, video rehashes, fanart, etc.
We don't need this drama though, let's not be our own worst enemy, but we also shouldn't tolerate certain things happening. They need to be corrected.
@angrytigerp I think you're on different wavelengths, actually. There's a pretty thick line between "Whatever, just please don't throw this in my face" and "You are cancer, GTFO".
VastaKustutaNot sure what else you're saying, honestly... What I'm saying is simply: don't be mean. In any situation. It never helps.
Basically, this is Fire Esper's reaction to all furry criticism on here: Fuck you, I'm a dragon.
VastaKustutaThis needs to stop now. Before the community splits in 2 and dies. Your all ruining it for everypony. Furry and nonfurry alike. Your all being morons. Stop.
VastaKustutaThis person spoke the truth and the whole truth.
VastaKustutaIt's kinda funny really, furryhaters say that furrys are killing us when it's the furryhaters which are doing that.
@Jebin Zedalu
VastaKustutaHeyyyy, that's what I said! Elephants never forget, but ponies are not elephants!
AS a poster above said, there will always be people that you don't like. I mean look around in class, at work, on the subway.
VastaKustutathose people always will be there, and we have to accept that. we however don't have to like that. we could even go out of our way and call that weirdo sitting next to you on the subway something offensive. In almost every (western)country you can. IRL that of course clashes heavily with the code of ethics, while the same situation on the internet would maybe make the someone raise an eyebrow and move on.
people need to to learn that THIS ISN'T real life. people will be more weird on the internet and people will be more offensive on the internet, all in the name of freedom of expression and anonymity. Also something we have to accept but not like.
so really, let people express themselves in weird and twisted ways and let the other be intolerant. but please let's not have this unnecessary meta-argument about it, because it will change nothing. at all.
so let us just move on and realize that the other side doesn't like you. if you were to be more considerate of the other (goes for both the haters and the hatees), that would be cool but not needed.
tl;dr
MOVE ON PEOPLE. really
I would rather see the community die with dignity than become another SatAM.
VastaKustutaThen leave Shaolin? Leave the community. Continue watching ponies, but leave the community. Simple as that
VastaKustuta@Jebin Zedalu What the... That's actually really clever. Points!
VastaKustutaI think one of the biggest attractions of the show is just the fact that it's so... Well, good. Not in quality, but in creating a world that is generally bright, kind and loving.
Just seeing something like this is much closer to our hearts than math ever will be.
@Bibo Welcome to the heard, brony!
I'm not a furry, and I like making Pony OC's for fun. I don't roleplay with them though, because furries honestly scare the ever-loving crap out of me.
VastaKustutaI don't even draw them that often, and I think I've only made two that're actual characters and not just "yay pony versions of my friends for this one friend's birthday~"
That said, I come from another fandom where FC's/OC's are "okay", maybe not loved by all but they aren't seen as cancerous or anything. Someone can make an OC and they can be a decent character, and exist in their own little world.
However, when they steal the spotlight away from the actual cast, or is inserted with them as if they're all BFF's? That's when it gets egotistical and disrespectful to the source material. (imho anyway)
why can't everyone here just stop arguing!?
VastaKustutathe more you argue the more hate you bring
why don't we just learn to ignore the things we don't like on the internet, and everything will be fine
I'm not going to say that people who identify as furries can't be fans of Frienship is Magic, that's bullshit.
VastaKustutaWhat I do advocate is that they leave their furfag bullshit back in Furaffinity and don't bring it to ponychan or Equestria Daily
@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutaI'm sorry, but you seem almost impossibly closed-minded in this comment. I wish there was a way I could change your mind, but you seem very firmly entrenched in your beliefs. I, personally, believe there are furries out there who love the show only for the humor and the characters. Yes, there are those that oversexualize the cast, but this is the internet and as such these things will happen. Your generalization sweeps to broadly, I think.
Boy, I sure love talking about ponies, and not participating in a flame war! Who else enjoys Pinkie Pie's nifty songs?
VastaKustutaEveryone, let's talk about ponies! That's what this blog is for, right?
I also vote for stopping the argument here.
VastaKustutaIt certainly won't change anything, or anyone's opinion. Everyone here seems pretty much adamant either way.
So I'll go to bed. It's never good to argue after midnight anyways.
@mariomarc: I have a question: Why can't we all discuss this as mature adults?
VastaKustutaWhen everyone shouts "stop arguing!!1!" it hinder's people's abilities to express themselves in a dignified matter. Discussion isn't the same as arguing, so please, let people talk for goodness sakes.
@Anonymous
VastaKustutaIt's NOT the over sexualization of the cast! It's not the fan fiction or the clopfics, since I'm a damn shipper myself.
No, it's that furries, when they find a fandom that they can easily integrate into, take it over and drag it down to their level. Look at Sonic, look at Star Fox, look at any Disney movie that involves animals at all. I mean, really, just take a few moments to peruse ff.net and do general page searches for "original character" or do the same thing at deviant art. They strangle out the rest of the community.
WILL YOU STOP ARGUING, FOR CELESTIA'S SAKE!!!
VastaKustutaWHAT DO YOU EXPECT ALL THIS ARGUING TO BRING YOU!?
@Fire.Esper
VastaKustutalol thanks, but I've been here a while.
You know, I really think that this was bound to happen. Sure, we found a show where people can, for the most part, show love and appreciation for one another by sharing something in common. But people can't expect every single individual to agree with things that happen along the way, good or bad. People will still butt heads and it will start fights.
VastaKustutaI do agree with the letter don't get me wrong, but I want to point out what angertigerp mentioned in part of his comment. For a show like MLP to spark life lessons that we should of learned back in grade school does make people like him judge bronies badly. However, if you take it as more of a "never forget the lessons you learned as a kid" kind of outlook, then that's fine and we can ignore that insult. I think the lessons are cute with how they have the characters learn the lessons every episode cause little girls will remember that. Girls that are the target audience. Not us. The reason we are all here is because of the internet. If not for the memes we wouldn't know of its existence. I wouldn't of been a fan if my boyfriend didn't show me the show in the first place, but again that's cause of the internet.
This community is really sweet and all, but just because this show has morals and cute ponies doesn't mean this is a perfect getup, there were always be haters no matter what fandom. This show shouldn't blind people of that. We should always be alert when dealing with the internet. Gotta say though, I never saw a community as strong as this one though before, makes me wish there were more of them in other fandoms...
I'm a big fan of the show, and even though I'm turning 20 in a few months, I always was a kid at heart. Personally a show like this showed me I could still feel like a kid enjoying cartoons again. An intelligent cartoon show so good that when I get older, I hope to show my children someday. Characters full of life, relatable, and pretty colors and silly humor. It was the cartoon I hoped for for a long time cause I don't have to preach that "90's cartoons are still better then nowadays" mentality less and less, cause of a wonderful like this.
So yeah, I could go on, but that should be enough. I hope some kind of common ground can be met soon. I am happy that at least the problems of the letter were addressed now then later. Later would just lead to more build up and anger after all.
The letter had some good points and some bad points, just like Sethisto warned us.
VastaKustutaI can see the concern about the furries. They have what I personally consider quite weird ideas about what's hot and what's not.
I won't be surprised if sooner or later, on DA or FA, you can come across pics of the group either in bondage, drawn with anthro bodies with giant tits and dicks, drawn to giant sizes and getting their rocks off against Canterlot Castle or working on eating eachother, be it sexually or physically.
You can cry and whine all you like about it, but that won't stop people from doing it.
I don't get *why* they do what they do, but us bitching and whining won't make them stop.
The same goes for trolls here. We can either feed them, or we can ignore them, and frankly, I enjoy this show too much to let a group of people like that ruin my day.
The whole thing with the shows morals is mainly aimed at little kids who are just now learning about these things. Me, I'm just there for the stories, the characters and the art.
The rest of the time I spend here on Equestria Daily, trolls or no trolls.
@Fon Shaolin Haha. You're funny, actually.
VastaKustutaWhen you stop being all puffy about it, drop by, have some tea with cupcakes. We still love you.
@Anonymous Surveying the comments, most people here have common sense with them at all times. Don't worry.
@The Paprika Killer There's really only one solution to this problem, just as there is in real life: learn that people can have different interests.
It's hard for us to do because we're all brought up with various views of intolerance. Entirely our fault. Look at how much crap gay people still getting, and that wasn't even an issue back in ancient Greece... A lot of things weren't actually...
Didn't Zeus have a hobby of transforming into a bull and knocking up chicks? Hell, even their gods were cooler.
@mariomarc: Please read the comment about discussion vs arguing, thank you.
VastaKustutaI think there is a gap in communication here, where people are mistaking the word 'furry' for 'exhibitionist'. The latter describes some of the former, and those are the people at issue; but no one, I think, is trying to say ALL furries are the issue.
VastaKustutaAt least, I know [i]I'm[/i] not...
What the hell is with the furry-phobia on this site? Some of you guys make me want to throw up. Just because's it's not YOUR kind of thing doesn't give you the right to treat them like that.
VastaKustuta@ Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutaHave you even looked at both the FiM community as it is today? It is already full of roleplay, self made characters, anthropomorphised or even humanised characters and clip fiction! And few if any of those involved with that are furries.
Looking at the furry community, I'd say it has less roleplay and pornographic stuff as a proportion than the FiM community has now!
So I don't really see what you're so worried about.
@Anonymous
VastaKustutaThis.
I love ponies. What's everyone's favorite character?
VastaKustutai think the reason these lessons affect some grown people is because they didn't get them when they were kids
VastaKustutaI am a firm believer in posting anonymously wherever possible. It doesn't change the content produced and it keeps petty rivalries and cliques from forming. I have a few friends in this community who I've known since before FiM existed who have taken on names for themselves (at least one has become very well known) and already I've seen the telltale signs of ego trips in some of them. I've also seen them get unnecessarily invested in exactly these kinds of arguments and become far too susceptible to the kind of responses they get to their work.
VastaKustutaBut whatever. I can't decide my friends' lives or choices for them, and I sure as hell can't change any individuals I don't know personally. This is the internet. The only safe way to peruse it is to assume that everyone else is a sociopath. This letter will be forgotten in a week's time by all except those who wish to ruin the writer's life and those who are too easily moved by words. The most something like this will do is strengthen the already-existent rift between individuals who consider themselves to be "heavy hitters" in a My Little Pony fandom on the internet. This letter and the comments surrounding it represent the only thing this community needs to purge itself of.
The only good suggestion I see in this letter is what all of the good members are doing already: Ignoring people. It doesn't matter if they have a name, or if you see their content everywhere, or if you feel they have more "power" in the fandom than you do. If you don't like the trolls, ignore them. If you don't like the new members, ignore them. If you don't like the fics, ignore them. If you don't like furries, ignore them. If you don't like Sethisto's favorite god damned breakfast cereals, ignore them. Just. Let it roll off your back. Ignore what you don't like. It doesn't matter if you're decrying something or defending something; you're still being a melodramatic embarrassment to all of us.
Communities aren't ruined by a particular group, or product, or event. They're ruined by the idiots that argue over what's ruining it.
Stop being idiots.
Sincerely,
a brony
@mariomarc Well if that's the case well then I can understand. I should of considered that, cause everyone has a different lifestyle and aren't taught all the same lessons in life that the general public would think.
VastaKustuta@Anonymous
VastaKustutaMine's Pinkie Pie! But only because I am her in real life. Like, we act so similar, it's scary.
@Anonymous
VastaKustutaRainbow Dash, she reminds me of my athletic/competitive side.
I find it funny that everyone has such an irrational hate on the furry fandom based on its porn reputation due to a overly prolific subgroup, yet ignore all of the easily far worse(In relation to the first)groups out there. But as usual, this is the internet and only you are right.
VastaKustuta@Ravell
VastaKustutaI'm administering the medicine one ailment at a time. Otherwise, the pill would be too big to swallow.
MY FAVOURITE PONY IS PINKIE PIE!!!
VastaKustuta@Dopey Shrove
VastaKustutaAaaaaaaaaand there's the first cry of fursecution.
And My favorite is...
VastaKustutaWell, it's a tie between Rarity, Pinkie and Fluttershy!
What's your favorite pony, Fon Shaolin?
@Anonymous
VastaKustutasuch as?
@Anonymous That's normal. I'm a furry, and furries still scare the crap out of me. RPers more so.
VastaKustutaBut that's just personal taste. Different strokes for different folks.
@Anonymous I'd recommend Ponychan for a good chat, personally. Honest.
@Fon Shaolin Don't worry about the future, it never actually happened. If you a contribute a little less whining, maybe it never even will!
@Bibo Better late than never!
Especially heart-warming to see someone with genuine distrust for the show be converted by the sheer magic. I, too, though never fancying in childish, only just barely gave it a chance before being firmly sucked in.
@Miss C You'll do great, don't worry. As long as new seasons keep on coming, the sheer quality of the show will make the fandom persevere.
@Fon Shaolin I feel like your condemnation of furries only pertains to a very small minority of the fanbase; as of this point in time, at least from what I've seen, such people aren't very prevalent. That's not to say that it won't happen, but from what I can tell FiM has a much greater following of "normal" fans than, say, the Sonic fandom. I doubt we're going to be swayed any by a few bad apples.
VastaKustuta@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustuta>close-minded, conservative, xenophobic, tea-party-like fag
>liked Avatard
>no_surprises_here.gif
do continue to bitch though, it amuses me so
Why is it that furries never let people have the freedom of disliking them?
VastaKustutaI understand that hatred is generally bad, but we either have to love and tolerate the furry fandom to iddy-biddy widdle pieces and kiss your furry bums, or we're being ever-so cruel.
You like what you like, you like what you dislike; and the same can be said for non-furries, so if we're vocal about our dislike for the fandom, then that's just too bad. Not all MLP fans are furries, y'know.
Interesting, I used to like being a brony and would post on ponychan daily, have a laugh and enjoy the love and tolerance. There was hate initially but it just made me lol "omg bronies from /b/? gtfo /co/ is where it's at. If only it hadn't become big (Too underground for you)". Haters gonna hate, business as usual.
VastaKustutaWait..Furries are starting to join the community? Well, whatever. I don't really enjoy it but I'll just ignore what i don't like.
NOPE.AVI
LET'S KILL THEM WITH FIRE, THAT'S HOW WE LOVE AND TOLERATE RIGHT? I mean why on Earth would furries join this community, stupid fucks? It's like..They were looking for a community of love and tolerance..Based on a show they love which spreads the message of LOVE AND TOLERANCE. There must be some logic here, but I just can't figure it out, anyone want to help me out here?
Nope, still can't figure it out. Well, let's just kill them with fire. That'll make them go away right, lol? Wait..People are RPing and creating OC?! ON MY FANDOM?! HOLY SHIT, I SHOULD PANIC AND SHUN THEM! IT'S NOT LIKE THEY'RE EXPLORING THEIR CREATIVITY OR ANYTHING! SHITSHITSHIT, THIS WILL SURELY KILL THE COMMUNITY..RIGHT, GUYS?
Holy fuck man..I think the community is going to shit! I mean people not liking what I don't like? Oh fuck..OH FUCK! THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE ACTUALLY WRITING SHIPPING?! -GRIMDARK-? I'm about to fucking faint. Other people actually enjoying writing and exploring the universe Faust created..The horror! And what's this? People are ENJOYING THEM?! OH MAN, THEY MUST BE CANCER.
TL;DR Shut the fuck up you stupid cunts. You want to make this community better? Cool, let's just exterminate the jews while we're at it to make the human race better, or the Muslim. Or even better! Let's kill all the Americans, they're all stupid fat bastards anyway!..Right?
@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutaI'm drawing an anthro Hoity Toity getting reacharound'd by 0r0. Watup g?
@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutaUMAD?
furrys did nothing bad too Sonic, the only thing bad about the sonic community is the recolours
I really want am about to just make this comment "this topic is now about cake" because look at yourselves, this is becoming a fucking trench war. I mean just STOP and go back to whatever it is that you are doing with the show.
VastaKustutaoh and fave pony? Nightmare Moon. get at me
I liked reading this letter. Wish I could post a Twilight Clap gif here. Many props to the guy who made it. I'm not a furry fan whatsoever, it can even creep me out sometimes, but I don't let it bother me. At most, I might post a criticizing comment (bad artstyle, way too creepy looking, etc) but nothing completely demeaning the artist, and I simply ignore the fan work I don't care for. Simple as that. I do agree with Fon that we should speak up on pieces that really have place in this community, but not completely trash the person making it.
VastaKustutaNow I can kinda understand where angrytigerp (boy you sure ARE angry) is coming from but I think you completely missed the point. Yes, we 20+ bronies shouldn't need a cartoon about magical talking ponies, primarily aimed at little girls to learn about proper morals.
The sad truth is, if we didn't need it, then why is there still so much strife and hate in the world? People are getting, beaten, robbed, shot, scammed, the works. Sure, I can understand that someone acting like a carefree hippy might make you feel disconcerted, but really, is it THAT bad of an idea to do just a little bit more to brighten someone's day. To stand up and say, "yeah we still value that, even in today's cynical society. 'FUCK YEAH!' to Frienship" That's how I see it.
If you want to just enjoy the show, tigerp, that's totally fine, but I really think you have the wrong idea on the whole "Friendship is magic", "Love and tolerate" and similar mantras that bronies have taken up in arms.
fon shaolin makes a lot of valid points, I'm all for love and tolerance but it gets hard to ignore when it keeps getting slapped in your face.
VastaKustuta@Anonymous All six. Plus Luna and Celestia. No, seriously.
VastaKustuta@Anonymous The only unfortunate thing there is that you even *need* an anonymous identity rather than expressing yourself clearly, politely, thoughtfully, expressing your actual thoughts under your real name.
A lot of problems in the world could be solved instantly if were weren't afraid to speak our mind regardless of social prejudices.
@Fon Shaolin HAHAHA! No, seriously, stop whining already. Bad pony.
to all the people disagreeing with all the hate, look up to that completely unnecessary Anon post. THAT is what the problem is. it's not people BEING offensive, it's people GETTING offended.
VastaKustuta"STOP LIKING WHAT I DON'T LIKE"
VastaKustutasee, but with furries it's
"STOP PERSECUTING ME BY NOT LIKING WHAT I LIKE!"
i understand that everyone has the right to discuss what they want, but this is just getting out of hand
VastaKustutawhy don't we stop discussing an internet subculture because it always starts flamewars to do so
and can we stop shunning people for expressing their creativity
why don't we talk about our favourite episode of the show?
How naive do you have to be to write drivel like this?
VastaKustutaA lot of people here are adults who watch a kids show and because of that, we as fans, associate adult themes to the show such as lesbianism, shipping etc. evident from shipping fics, clop fics, rule 34 and so on.
Just because you watch a show about friendship doesn't mean the fan community you are part of is all flowers and sunshine with nothing wrong with it at all. You are obviously going to "fall out of love" with the community if you hold to the childish expectation that everyone is going to be friends with everyone and everything will be smooth.
Snap back to reality Ben. There will always be trolls, there will always be people who will argue, there will always be people who hate shipping fics and there will always be people who hate furfags. You're 21, you should know these things by now.
The thing you can do to stop the community from trotting down the wrong "path" is to not post stuff like this. Not only does it look preachy but it conforms to a hater's expectations and perceptions of a "furfag."
Sometimes, you have to be aware of how people perceive the archetypes of others and start respecting people's perception of different types of fans. For example, people typically hate Mormons because they are door knockers that cheese you off but if you met a Mormon who wasn't all preachy or door knocking, you'd actually find that they are pretty cool.
You're cool with me Ben, just don't go writing preachy stuff which has great potential to be trollbait.
Oh look a letter witten by a furry causing major drama. Honestly, before this was posted I noticed very little furry hate. Personally, I do fear what the furries will do to the fandom and it's reputation with it's art and "Bawwww Fursecution!" drama. I dread the day I start running into hardcore mlp rule 34.
VastaKustuta@mariomarc
VastaKustutaThis this this this
Let's just stfu about this stupid shit and get on with our lifes. Not like it really matters anyway.
@Anonymous
VastaKustutaU mad bro?
Don't worry, I'm gonna love and tolerate the...
You know what, fuck it, that shit's getting old. And gimmicky.
@mariomarc
VastaKustutaOh, I don't know, because that's not what this post was for? It was for discussing what the author of that letter says are the bad things in the community, one of which is the "fursecution" of the furries.
If you want to discuss the show, go to ponychan and start a thread on the appropriate board.
@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutaI was going to counter some of your arguments but I realized something halfway through typing the first one
your not worth the effort
I say good day to you
@Fire.Esper
VastaKustutaYeah, was perhaps the biggest backfire. Now I love the show, and sometimes I can get my brother to watch lately.
On the furry thing though, I don't mind the anthro stuff, some of it is pretty well drawn. I just really find the sexual stuff disturbing. It makes me think they're into bestiality, and as I sit here with my chihuahua asleep in my lap I don't want to imagine someone fantasizing sexual thoughts about such a small creature. Just knowing that there's people out there like that though scares and sickens me.
My ex gf was a furry, and the stuff she looked at was weird, she would even make me go on second life and do role playing stuff with people who I didn't even know. It was just weird.
I'm not saying all furries are weird, it's just that most of them seem to cross the line, that, or they're the loudest among other communities.
@Anonymous
VastaKustutaDoh-ho-ho
You're a clever one
@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutahttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v345/0r0ch1/fonshaolin.png
I like what he's saying, but I think it all needs to be put on the table. My full response...
VastaKustutahttp://www.ponychan.net/chan/chat/res/91680.html
@Anonymous How could we possibly take that freedom away from you? You see those one-two trolls posting here calling them "cancer"? That's why people are upset, not because of someone who just doesn't share their interests.
VastaKustutaHere's my vote. Don't like me. It's cool. I'm just here for ponies, like everyone else.
@Anonymous So long as your comments outweigh the "gb2b" crowd, it's all honey. Don't worry about it. ;)
@The Paprika Killer Nightmare Moon rocks.
@Anonymous What are you doing? Don't agree with trolls.
This is Zutara all over again. There were a lot of Zutara fans (Smoosh name for a romance between Zuko and Katara from Avatar: The Last Airbender) who preached about "Tolerance" about their preference for their ship. The thing is that tolerence only extended to them. People who had other ideas were "opressing" them.
VastaKustutaFandoms go crazy, and the ones who are responsible are entitled fans. It just happens that the furry fandom has a lot of entitled fans. Guys, don't go crazy, just accept that there are those that don't like what you like.
@mariomarc
VastaKustutaHey! Good to see you here!
Anyways, I'm super indecisive, so I can't decide on a favorite episode. But I would have to say that Sonic Rainboom, Cutie Mark Chronicles, both pilot episodes, Art of the Dress, and Winter Wrapup are definately among my favorites!
@ Anon 1:51AM
VastaKustutaIt seems to be more of a case of "I can't enjoy what I like because as soon as I mention it you start ragging on me."
All three are true :D
Hot DANM this is a huge wall of comments for two hours after midnight.
VastaKustutaThe guy's right though, people keep trying to bitch at one thing or another. and it's getting worse quite quickly as this fandom becomes more mainstream
I'd really like to see this fandom hold itself a cut above what's justified by saying "It's the internet, live with it".
I got attracted to this community in the first place because it seemed like somewhere that was on a road to changing that perception of what was just "the unavoidable accepted culture of the internet".
Anything to keep the Love and friendship flowing people.
@0r0ch1
VastaKustutahttp://img30.imageshack.us/img30/9961/withloved.jpg
Autor on selle kommentaari eemaldanud.
VastaKustutaThat's why many people despise and ignore all the anonymous imageboards like 4chan etc.. A cess-pool of humanity, a paradise for trolls, no wonder MLP fandom is having troubles there.. Solution - leave them rot there and focus on forums and dedicated fan-sites activity, which will be a lot more healthy and controlled overall. There is a limit for friendship and tolerance.. If i see a pile of dung left on the floor, im not going to "tolerate" it, im going to mop it off. The problem is.. You have no power to mop off such a human-piles over 4chan-alike resources. Absolutely no way. Dont be mistaken, some people are beyond the power of friendship and tolerance, it's even up to all the kind of brain/psychic damage which requires medical help, some times ever brain surgery to help them become adequate people again..
VastaKustutaI'll take a pass at this, though my humble opinion will probably be lost in the sea of responses this thread is bound to generate.
VastaKustutaWhile it's true that some of the neighsayers have been intolerably rude, the more polite and articulate ones do have a valid point. It seems that some people are losing sight of the fact that this community is supposed to be dedicated to MLP FiM at its core. I know that's why I'm here at least. I'm not here for furries, OCs, shipping, clop fics, grimdark, etc. It's *fine* for everybody to participate and be excited about ponies (even if I don't always agree with their tastes), but I don't want the core focus of the community to drift away from the thing that brought us all here in the first place: My Little Pony Friendship is Magic, the show. If the focus does shift I doubt I'll stick around, and that would sadden me. It seems somewhat ironic that I fear being alienated from the MLP FiM community because I'm here for MLP FiM . . .
-eef
So many people using Straw Ponies and Logical Fallacies in these comments, it's ridiculous.
VastaKustutaCan you guys just calm down? I mean seriously.
Interesting read, but it won't go solving the problems of the community, as proven by the above. But It's at least interesting.
I do say, I think consultation and discussion is great and all, but let's not turn it into an argument here(too late though). In an argument, everyone loses. In a discussion, everyone wins.
VastaKustuta@0r0ch1
VastaKustutaI just want to quote this again, so you all get a good long look at this. This is all the fandom will be in a few months or a year if we tolerate it. Furries who live vicariously through our fandom so that they can screw animals.
That's what it all boils down to, folks.
@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutahttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v345/0r0ch1/kimyongilloling.jpg
Psst, everypony...Fon Shaolin...is trolling you all. Either than or is pants on head retarded.
VastaKustutaDon't take this the wrong way Fon, but if you aren't trolling then you're being incredibly antagonistic. I'm all for us acting like human beings on the internet and being able to call each other wankers or hate on those different (it's what we as a species do best). There's also a clear dichotomy from the hate of /sci/ (was gonna say /b/, but then realised how much more vicious it is coming from those guys) to the sycophantic niceties of ponychan. Let's just sit in the middle, chill out and post pictures of ponies.
Rome didn't fall because of barbarians, it fell because they predicted it's fall (or something like that, I forget the real quote). The community really doesn't need policing or finger pointing and ostracising, a simple concept with communities (and memetics in general) is if the idea or show is good enough it'll last. Yada yada, fuck I'm tired. Hope some of that didn't make sense.
http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Trollface.png
VastaKustuta0r0ch1 & Fon Shaolin,
VastaKustutaCould you two take it somewhere that doesn't completely validate both points the original guy was trying to make?
@Dopey Shrove
VastaKustutait's not this site it's just a couple people, remember not to feed the Parasprites.
@Fon Shaolin
you're gonna hate me. I'm thinking about shipping my OC with a Lion I saw on DA. My OC, Hatesteed, was always quiet and had trouble making friends growing up in Fillydelphia. He spent most of his young adult life traveling throughout equestria playing music where ever they would let him. He has only played two gigs outside the Pony Kingdom and is seriously considering moving into the foreign lands. Maybe there is a land far beyond the Everfree Forest where lions live, until the show says otherwise or someone uses superior logic to disprove my theory, I'm gonna say who knows what species live in this world
does it make you angry that I write a story about a character which live in a universe you don't want contaminated? I just want to use my imagination to escape reality and imagine life in the wonderful world of Equestria. Please let me keep my fantasy world. It is far funner to think about than my crappy real life.
@Rob
VastaKustutaI can't do that and I'm honestly not trolling. I have seen fandoms fall to both furries and furry-like behavior. Good, solid fandoms overrun by mary sues, original characters, and things that have absolutely nothing to do with the core material.
I see it coming. It will be horrible and complete and we'll all wonder at what point our fun little fandom went to shit.
@Anonymous
VastaKustutaBut it's so fun rattling the little guy's cage, he's so full of passion, look at him
@Anonymous You have your math backwards.
VastaKustuta@Anonymous No, it's not. See those one-two troll posts? That's why they're upset.
@Anonymous Don't worry, those stereotypes are about as accurate as those of gay people being flaming Satan-worshipping perverts.
@Bibo I wish I knew how to deal with social norms. Really.
As for furries: it's perfectly okay not to like what other people like. I'm the most hard-core furry I know, and a ton of the fandom and things in it really creep me the fuck out.
Thankfully, I have my irony meter with me at all times, to know not to shout at people to stop liking what I don't like when I'm busy liking what other people don't like.
@0r0ch1 HAHA! Have a cookie, sir.
(Especially if you really are orochi - thank you!)
hahaha! I lol'd so hard when I saw that the picture for this post was Twilight standing on a soapbox!
VastaKustutaI applaud you Mr. Sims. This point needed to be made. I hope that we can all take what you have said to heart.
VastaKustutaAutor on selle kommentaari eemaldanud.
VastaKustuta@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutayou seem to be the Hitler of our community
I still don't see why there's OC-hate lumped together with Furry hate.
VastaKustutaOC's can be fun and interesting, and they've been around since G1 days. It's a toy-line that requires little girls to use their imagination and often make up their own stories and characters; this fandom having OC's is only natural.
Furries are also expected, but again, I don't think an OC that's done well should be despised just as badly as a sparkle-pony fursona...
Autor on selle kommentaari eemaldanud.
VastaKustutapeople this is really getting old, so i'm just going to some up my thoughts really quick
VastaKustuta1. not all furries like posting OC's and messing with the existing universe of someone else's material, i'm sure there are non furries that do it as well, though
2. people should be aloud to post fanfiction and create OC's, etc., since it allows them to develop their creativity
3. we should learn to ignore things we don't like
if someone makes something you don't like, and you feel the need to say something, then say something constructive
if it's just hating on something, it's gets nobody nowhere
we are all going to have different opinions about everything and that is fine, but if people try to just force their opinions on everyone else, it's just rude and annoying
stop arguing because all it's doing is tearing us apart, and tearing the fandom apart
no matter what though, I WILL CONTINUE TO LOVE AND TOLERATE ALL OF YOU, cause i'm sure that deep down, all of you deserve it
so can we please stop the hate and hug & make up?
You know, there's stuff in this fandom I don't really care for, like the grimdark and Scootabuse stuff for example. I just choose not to look at it and go look at something I do like instead. There's no shortage of pony content to choose from.
VastaKustuta@Jack Pipsam
VastaKustutaAnd now the furries are comparing themselves to the jews during the holocaust. Not only is that disgusting, it's a perfect example of why you are cancerous to a community.
THIS IS A WONDERFUL START TO MY TWILIGHT DAY
VastaKustutaTHANK YOU
@Anonymous Even if it doesn't make the cut, there will always be creative people around... And, of course, the show itself. ;)
VastaKustutaFon...you make an odd statement. your argument is that if I open the door marked "Series" I really get "Fandom subculture" instead of having three separate doors marked "Series" and "Fandom" and "Fandom subculture".
VastaKustutaStart being less Obsessive-Compulsive-hater and let people do what they want. You are acting like the series is going to die due to a minority of the fandom...LIKING IT!
people this is really getting old, so i'm just going to some up my thoughts really quick
VastaKustuta1. not all furries like posting OC's and messing with the existing universe of someone else's material, i'm sure there are non furries that do it as well, though
2. people should be aloud to post fanfiction and create OC's, etc., since it allows them to develop their creativity
3. we should learn to ignore things we don't like
if someone makes something you don't like, and you feel the need to say something, then say something constructive
if it's just hating on something, it's gets nobody nowhere
we are all going to have different opinions about everything and that is fine, but if people try to just force their opinions on everyone else, it's just rude and annoying
stop arguing because all it's doing is tearing us apart, and tearing the fandom apart
no matter what though, I WILL CONTINUE TO LOVE AND TOLERATE ALL OF YOU, cause i'm sure that deep down, all of you deserve it
so can we please stop hating and just hug & make up?
people this is really getting old, so i'm just going to some up my thoughts really quick
VastaKustuta1. not all furries like posting OC's and messing with the existing universe of someone else's material, i'm sure there are non furries that do it as well, though
2. people should be aloud to post fanfiction and create OC's, etc., since it allows them to develop their creativity
3. we should learn to ignore things we don't like
if someone makes something you don't like, and you feel the need to say something, then say something constructive
if it's just hating on something, it's gets nobody nowhere
we are all going to have different opinions about everything and that is fine, but if people try to just force their opinions on everyone else, it's just rude and annoying
stop arguing because all it's doing is tearing us apart, and tearing the fandom apart
no matter what though, I WILL CONTINUE TO LOVE AND TOLERATE ALL OF YOU, cause i'm sure that deep down, all of you deserve it
so can we please stop hating and just hug & make up?
@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutaI cannot speak on behalf of furrys for the simple reason that I am not one, however if you think that anybody who sticks up for them is automatically one then your just plane silly.
but you are treating them like some outsider, what right do you have to tell others to go away, what right do you have to try and turn others on others?
what right?
please tell me
@Jack Pipsam I second that observation.
VastaKustuta@Anonymous People just like to lump things together, because otherwise it gets too hard to think. We're dumb that way.
@Fon Shaolin I believe that was about you being about as welcome as Hitler. Or cancer for that matter.
Personally I'm glad to see bronies have common sense to treat someone like that as a troll. Just stop being so insecure, please? We're all friends here. Metaphorically speaking.
Don't be a douche, guy.
@Fon Shaolin
VastaKustutaI see it coming. It will be horrible and complete and we'll all wonder at what point our fun little fandom went to shit.
Right now that sure sounds way more like you than anything else...
Care to just knock off the ridiculous behavior if you aren't actually just being a parasprite? You deliberately being offensive has no chance of improving anything, only making it worse.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=257985&page=5 And now for something different!
VastaKustutaWow, this made me realise just how isolated the /b/ threads are...
VastaKustutaNot that I'm saying they're any better.
I actually do agree with Fon though. To think that furries actually compare fandumb "fursecution" to anti-semitism, the holocaust, and persectution of other religions actually makes me wanna puke.
VastaKustutaAlso someone actually called Fon this fandom's Hitler. I'm sorry? But usually the minute I hear someone talk about Hitler in a non WW2 discussion, I automatically assume that person uses the typical American argument tactic; "Oh yeah? WELL YOU DUN WANNA BE EVIL, DO YA? If you disagree with me, you're evil!"
@mariomarc Internet hug activate! *hug*
VastaKustutaAlso, ponies. Let's not lose our priorities here. Ponies is what we're here for, and no amount of trolls or furries are taking that away.
Well, a lot of trolls and furries are drawing them, actually. It's a Win/Win.
i have a new idea people
VastaKustutajust ignore Fon Shaolin
i'm going to start right now
One person's actions do not represent the community as a whole.
VastaKustutaHoly shit.
@Fire.Esper
VastaKustutaThen I can say I respect you.
This comment section is the first time I've ever vocalized my feelings on furries, and I'm glad a furry like you was the first one to respond, and with an understanding at that. So I thank you.
I would prefer if I never had to see the sexual MLP images ever again, but I also have to understand that some people like that and they're going to post it, so the only thing I can do is just tolerate it.
@Anonymous
VastaKustutayou clearly did not get the point, oh and good job calling me american.
which I am not fyi
We are all individuals. Just like to remind some people of that here.
VastaKustuta@Anonymous No one's doing that... The guy who wrote it isn't even a furry (irony points).
VastaKustutaOh and, persecution has the same face regardless of where it is or what it's about. Don't worry, you'll get a serving of it yourself in the coming months. See for yourself what fun it is.
i'm going to leave this thread alone now
VastaKustutabut before i go i just want to say i love everyone here
*group hug*
good night